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[Music]

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and good afternoon from Philadelphia

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Frank here with yet another episode of

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UFO news network Sunday quarantine

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edition we've got a great show for you

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today so let's not waste any time let me

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bring on mykos for today as always the

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one and only chant had a chant how are

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you today I'm doing great Frank thank

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you so much we have a very special show

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today we have three guests that will be

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on with us today Jen Aldridge just let

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me know

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how we can reach him by the way but our

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show is based on partly on the USS

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Nimitz a UFO incident tik-tok topic it

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was a radar visual encounter of an

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unidentified flying object by u.s.

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fighter pilots of the Nimitz Carrier

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Strike Group in 2004 two f-18 Super

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Hornet pilots led by the commander of

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the strike force squadron 41

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communicated that they saw a flying

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object radar signals were seen by US

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Navy ships and aircraft in the area as

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well an inferred video recording taking

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from an f-18 and that part of the

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incident has also been released this

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topic was covered heavily by many folks

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in the UFO community and also picked up

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by mainstream media we're here to talk

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about this topic with a veteran

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researcher a Christian lab right and

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also Dave Beatty who's a Christian lab

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writes who's FOIA request was famously

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rejected by the US Navy on this topic

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and the US Navy responded to Christian

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Lambright by saying top secret UFO FILES

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could cause grave damage to US and

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national security if these docks were

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released we're going to go and cover

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that in a second but I'd like to go

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ahead and give a bio on Christian

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Lambright first a Christian has worked

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extensively in computer technology and

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Internet services has a background in

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graphic arts illustration and CGI and

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holds a degree in psychology from Baylor

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University he is a former investigator

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for the Center for UFO studies and

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contributor to the computer UFO network

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is a licensed private investigator also

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and currently resides in Austin Texas

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he's working on a documentary film on a

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class

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exciting doing independent research and

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always writing a Christian wanted to go

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to you first and ask you can you please

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cover the topic regarding that famous

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FOIA request u.s. submitted to the US

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Navy where you were rejected and they

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responded by saying it would cause grave

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damage to national security if they

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succumb to the request that you asked

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for and well as everybody seems to do

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ultimately decides to do an f.y.i

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request you come up with an idea and

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something you want to know and maybe

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it's a curse but ultimately I just go

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straight to the source I mean when I

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realize for some reason I hadn't really

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seen anybody go directly to oh and I in

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particular and I've been working on the

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paper which Dave is familiar with and in

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the process had come across the two

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seemingly supportive comments that

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indicated oh and I had done an

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investigation one the office of naval

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investment tell us about that yes and of

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course the other comment that Linda Howe

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had brought up in some an email she'd

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gotten from Eric Davis that indicated

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that I know and I person had done an

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information and I did specify that

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week's time period where the majority of

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the nimitz information we've heard about

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has come from and it resulted

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surprisingly relatively quickly I have

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to admit that's you know that was pretty

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quick overall but um maybe it was easy

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to just say you can't have anything so

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it didn't take very long to go that I

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had to go that route but anyway and that

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led to that and of course then I

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mentioned it to I guess I'd had it for

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about three or four weeks at which I

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responded to them and forwarded it

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because of the comment about a video and

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the original I guess classification of

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authority on the video was the was a

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naval air Navy R so I submitted a

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request to them which

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now it's been three months or almost

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going on three still waiting but but

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ultimately then I mentioned it to Paul

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Dean and of course then he posted it and

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it went all over from much much further

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than I ever would have even imagined but

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I guess part of that to do - Paul - Paul

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Dean's credibility but everybody picked

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up on it and it went from there which

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you know we don't want to read too much

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into what they mean by saying that you

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know there's always lots of factors that

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may impact it but the idea that they've

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got information they want to release

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when to the stars had been releasing

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videos here and there and talking up a

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storm so why suddenly go quiet on oh and

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I end it's a great question I also

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wanted to bring in Dave Beatty on this

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topic so he can discuss that with you so

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just wanna let our listeners know we

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have the creator of the USS Nimitz

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encounter film a famous film done by

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Dave C Beatty who's going to join us

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today and he's an Emmy award-winning

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filmmaker and producer he has also had a

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lifelong interest in the UFO topic like

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many of all of us he was excited about

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the news regarding the Pentagon having

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had a secret project and he was also

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interested about the extraordinary UFO

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encounter that was also featured in the

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New York Times article that broke the

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Pentagon UFO news I wanted to just ask

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you a table do you mind giving us your

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thoughts on the topic that Christian is

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covering right now yeah hey by the way

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I've been following you know Christians

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work for quite a while and he and I have

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been discussing this case probably since

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the very beginning trying to figure out

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ways in which we could ferret out the

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lore of details about the case and of

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course you know reading the response to

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his FOIA was pretty intriguing because

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up until that point most researchers

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including myself that had submitted

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multiple voyeurs have been met with no

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records found in this case this was one

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of the first times related to this

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incident that we found that not only did

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the US Navy have documents and videos

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that they were revealing were related to

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the 2004 incident that they were also

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designated as top-secret and would not

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be released so though all the points

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that I had done up to that time came

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back as non-responsive with you know in

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some cases the Navy would tell me that

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the information you're seeking for

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instance flight logs of the jet aircraft

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for instance we know that there were

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some event summaries that had been

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posted previously we were trying to find

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those they would come back saying that

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in cases of u.s. Navy training

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activities the records are kept for two

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years on the ships and then asked per

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Navy naval regulations destroyed after

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two years you know a lot of us kept

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going after that way after FOIA and

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trying to find other details so it was

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quite frustrating and I think that you

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know when we saw Christians know the

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idea that they do have information even

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though it's not released at this time

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was heartening for us and obviously it

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kind of struck a nerve in the community

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and also around the world a lot of

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headlines across the u.s. and the world

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Christian do you have any thoughts no

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Davis correct I have been talking to

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Dave a good bit over the several months

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since last year and he and Tim ik no one

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had have always been helpful and we've

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exchanged information on this side of

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thing and and I agree with him I mean

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it's surprising even Paul Dehn mention

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you know that I got the response

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relatively quickly and I don't know if

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that's somebody was ready and they knew

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ultimately they're just going to have to

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present that so it was a quick and easy

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thing to do or why because yeah being

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stalled seems to be the the the plan

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these days and I think many of us

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probably already feel that there is

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a reasonable intent to not give you

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information that's potentially sensitive

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and if they can interpret your request

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in a way that they can legally say no we

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don't have it or whatever else because

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of some technicality they don't have you

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know I've been told before when they say

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we eff away does not require we answer

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questions it's just a jump and yeah yeah

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just to jump in really quick Christian

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the material you were falling for was

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related to a slide show and that can you

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talk a little bit about that a little

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bit more detail in fact I you know I

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guess to some extent even I have to

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think all right I wonder how I worded

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something that made me lucky enough that

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there was no way to avoid some type of

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response I mean I I even say that I feel

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that way at times but I have a couple of

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friends and they know who they are that

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I generally ask questions so they give

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advice on how to word things be very you

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know this sort of thing

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but the point was I wrote to oh and I

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specifically asking for information

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relating to events you try to be very

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specific but also broad enough that

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you're covering the it almost sounds

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like legalese sometimes that you have to

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spell it out in a certain specific way

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so you kind of cover what you're asking

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for but you don't limit it or they can't

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in reinterpret you don't want to be too

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specific and when I I didn't even ask

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specifically for the slides per se I

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asked for any information material I'd

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have to go back and read exactly how it

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was worded relating to any events

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dealing with on the night you give them

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to the terms whether it's you AP tic-tac

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whatever terminology might be applicable

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in the specific timeframe of November in

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a week's time period where flavors

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occurred incidence generally occurred

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and so it was a rather surprising to get

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the response from them where they

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stipulate there are these slides which

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certainly sounds like somebody giving

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either a presentation or somebody was

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presenting information they they

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obtained from somewhere but of course

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even that's vague and and then the

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information about them having hat

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because you also need to be sure that

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you stipulate if any information that

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they have originated with another source

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that you request that they contacted the

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other source and tell you that they've

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done so otherwise I don't think they

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necessarily have to tell you so in this

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particular case that may have been a

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caveat that meant they had to tell me

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they have this video from Naval Air but

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since they're not the original

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classification authority they have to go

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to naval air etc etc etc which of course

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gives you the information that ah there

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is this other party who's somewhere came

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up with this video why wouldn't that

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video have been in with whatever else

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was gathered supposedly that the people

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that flew in and took it why is Naval

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Air have a video that is not where you

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00:12:56,170 --> 00:12:54,199
know where did the others come from I

275
00:12:58,929 --> 00:12:56,180
don't know but you pick up clues and

276
00:13:01,120 --> 00:12:58,939
then you hopefully you go from there but

277
00:13:02,679 --> 00:13:01,130
but you're right Frank's right when you

278
00:13:03,910 --> 00:13:02,689
come back and you hear about slides and

279
00:13:06,400 --> 00:13:03,920
things then of course that makes you

280
00:13:08,170 --> 00:13:06,410
begin to imagine where would they have

281
00:13:10,900 --> 00:13:08,180
obtained slides and what would be in

282
00:13:13,509 --> 00:13:10,910
those slides but I don't know I mean I

283
00:13:15,340 --> 00:13:13,519
it is difficult especially from some

284
00:13:18,429 --> 00:13:15,350
experiences I've had in the last week or

285
00:13:22,030 --> 00:13:18,439
two to be aware that sometimes it's easy

286
00:13:23,799 --> 00:13:22,040
to miss read or misinterpret exactly

287
00:13:26,079 --> 00:13:23,809
what it is so I don't want anybody to

288
00:13:28,689 --> 00:13:26,089
assume that it's a video we might not

289
00:13:30,579 --> 00:13:28,699
have seen perhaps Naval Air has one they

290
00:13:33,879 --> 00:13:30,589
just don't want to release or they need

291
00:13:37,120 --> 00:13:33,889
to sign off on it having a video doesn't

292
00:13:38,920 --> 00:13:37,130
automatically mean that it's not one

293
00:13:40,840 --> 00:13:38,930
that you know that we haven't seen or

294
00:13:42,879 --> 00:13:40,850
that we would think shows anything we're

295
00:13:44,319 --> 00:13:42,889
seeing but it tells you that there are

296
00:13:46,600 --> 00:13:44,329
people out there who have gathered

297
00:13:48,759 --> 00:13:46,610
information on this so it's not it was

298
00:13:53,920 --> 00:13:48,769
not a dead issue that nobody followed up

299
00:13:57,639 --> 00:13:53,930
on okay I wanted to mention something

300
00:14:00,790 --> 00:13:57,649
that's interesting and that is to Dave

301
00:14:04,509 --> 00:14:00,800
actually Dave we've had you on many

302
00:14:07,419 --> 00:14:04,519
times on our show and I did account

303
00:14:08,840 --> 00:14:07,429
regarding the tic-tac topic and how many

304
00:14:12,410 --> 00:14:08,850
times

305
00:14:14,569 --> 00:14:12,420
that this network has done a show on it

306
00:14:17,930 --> 00:14:14,579
I've been on the majority of these shows

307
00:14:23,290 --> 00:14:17,940
this will be our 20th show on the

308
00:14:26,540 --> 00:14:23,300
tic-tac topic and believe I did like a -

309
00:14:29,329 --> 00:14:26,550
maybe two or more hour-long show with

310
00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:29,339
you dave was a it was an interesting

311
00:14:34,220 --> 00:14:32,610
show and I wanted to ask you before the

312
00:14:37,759 --> 00:14:34,230
show when we were talking about this

313
00:14:40,670 --> 00:14:37,769
topic you mentioned that you have

314
00:14:43,129 --> 00:14:40,680
testimony from two new USS Princeton

315
00:14:44,920 --> 00:14:43,139
vets before I go into that question I

316
00:14:47,629 --> 00:14:44,930
just wanted to mention to our listeners

317
00:14:50,139 --> 00:14:47,639
we did a really interesting I think it

318
00:14:55,100 --> 00:14:50,149
was like a three or four hour long show

319
00:14:57,740 --> 00:14:55,110
with two USS Nimitz folks and then two

320
00:15:02,389 --> 00:14:57,750
USS Nimitz I'm sorry Princeton folks

321
00:15:04,939 --> 00:15:02,399
that all covered the tic-tock topic and

322
00:15:06,970 --> 00:15:04,949
we're witnesses to it or we're involved

323
00:15:10,610 --> 00:15:06,980
in that topic in some one way or another

324
00:15:12,019 --> 00:15:10,620
my question to you Dave is regarding

325
00:15:15,019 --> 00:15:12,029
what we were talking about before the

326
00:15:17,600 --> 00:15:15,029
show you were talking about - you knew

327
00:15:19,129 --> 00:15:17,610
USS Princeton vets and they don't

328
00:15:21,949 --> 00:15:19,139
necessarily want to come forward at this

329
00:15:25,069 --> 00:15:21,959
point but they may have given you a bit

330
00:15:26,540 --> 00:15:25,079
of information that you want I mean that

331
00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:26,550
you may want to cover do you want to

332
00:15:31,030 --> 00:15:29,370
give us some insight on that topic yeah

333
00:15:34,910 --> 00:15:31,040
absolutely

334
00:15:38,110 --> 00:15:34,920
at the end of the film I ask people to

335
00:15:42,160 --> 00:15:38,120
contact me if they had information about

336
00:15:46,069 --> 00:15:42,170
witnesses from military ships or any

337
00:15:47,929 --> 00:15:46,079
related sightings and you know I've been

338
00:15:50,420 --> 00:15:47,939
overwhelmed actually with the response

339
00:15:54,189 --> 00:15:50,430
since the film was posted on YouTube a

340
00:15:56,689 --> 00:15:54,199
long time ago no part of that has been

341
00:15:59,569 --> 00:15:56,699
witnesses that have contacted me from

342
00:16:01,400 --> 00:15:59,579
the actual ships involved on USS Nimitz

343
00:16:05,150 --> 00:16:01,410
in versus print listening as you just

344
00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:05,160
said and after those the first version

345
00:16:09,170 --> 00:16:06,810
of the film that I ever did and I think

346
00:16:11,929 --> 00:16:09,180
you guys you know were had me on show

347
00:16:16,610 --> 00:16:11,939
back at that time you know this was

348
00:16:18,500 --> 00:16:16,620
going back to 2018 and even before right

349
00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:18,510
I mean it was like the whole thing

350
00:16:22,460 --> 00:16:20,490
started in 2017 and then I

351
00:16:25,760 --> 00:16:22,470
working on that film about that time and

352
00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:25,770
then released it in 2018 that's when I

353
00:16:32,600 --> 00:16:29,730
got Kevin you know Kevin de Gary or Keys

354
00:16:34,460 --> 00:16:32,610
Patrick Hughes Jason Turner all these

355
00:16:36,710 --> 00:16:34,470
guys came forward and contacted me

356
00:16:39,590 --> 00:16:36,720
because they saw this sort of

357
00:16:43,060 --> 00:16:39,600
organically popular video on YouTube

358
00:16:46,100 --> 00:16:43,070
that I just gave to everybody for free

359
00:16:48,350 --> 00:16:46,110
well you know that has continued on even

360
00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:48,360
though I finished the film it's been out

361
00:16:52,519 --> 00:16:49,890
there for a while I keep getting emails

362
00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:52,529
I keep getting contacted people saying

363
00:16:59,290 --> 00:16:55,050
hey I want to talk to you about what I

364
00:17:02,510 --> 00:16:59,300
witnessed on the ship and two new

365
00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:02,520
gentlemen have come forward this year

366
00:17:08,870 --> 00:17:05,730
that have sort of given me and a few

367
00:17:10,189 --> 00:17:08,880
other people you are cross or would it

368
00:17:13,939 --> 00:17:10,199
to an automated voice-messaging system

369
00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:13,949
you know what what is and Aldridge sort

370
00:17:20,720 --> 00:17:17,010
of interesting is they concur with the

371
00:17:24,370 --> 00:17:20,730
other guys they for the most part their

372
00:17:27,650 --> 00:17:24,380
stories parallel what Kevin and Gary

373
00:17:31,820 --> 00:17:27,660
Jason's on witnessed in those several

374
00:17:34,130 --> 00:17:31,830
days some unique factors are that both

375
00:17:36,110 --> 00:17:34,140
of these guys independently of each

376
00:17:39,430 --> 00:17:36,120
other they don't even know each other

377
00:17:43,190 --> 00:17:39,440
actually that said that they saw these

378
00:17:48,260 --> 00:17:43,200
UFOs with their own eyes on the deck of

379
00:17:49,880 --> 00:17:48,270
USS Princeton the guys reported to me

380
00:17:51,350 --> 00:17:49,890
that you know he was aware what was

381
00:17:54,740 --> 00:17:51,360
happening because it was going on for

382
00:17:57,350 --> 00:17:54,750
probably a week as you know in November

383
00:17:58,549 --> 00:17:57,360
of 2004 they were having these tracks

384
00:18:02,180 --> 00:17:58,559
that they didn't know what they were

385
00:18:04,010 --> 00:18:02,190
they thought perhaps it was a problem

386
00:18:06,500 --> 00:18:04,020
with their radar systems during that

387
00:18:09,049 --> 00:18:06,510
first initial three or four days they

388
00:18:13,669 --> 00:18:09,059
were doing Diagnostics trying to get rid

389
00:18:15,740 --> 00:18:13,679
of these weird tracks and then after you

390
00:18:17,120 --> 00:18:15,750
know the whole intercept happened the

391
00:18:19,850 --> 00:18:17,130
whole big story that we all know about

392
00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:19,860
you know they knew this stuff was real

393
00:18:24,350 --> 00:18:22,290
and both guys independently of each

394
00:18:26,450 --> 00:18:24,360
other actually they would sometimes go

395
00:18:31,159 --> 00:18:26,460
out at night because both guys their

396
00:18:33,919 --> 00:18:31,169
watch was all night perhaps from you

397
00:18:34,370 --> 00:18:33,929
know you know ten or eleven till 6:00 in

398
00:18:36,650 --> 00:18:34,380
the morning

399
00:18:39,830 --> 00:18:36,660
so they'd be up all night doing their

400
00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:39,840
particular lot and they'd go out on the

401
00:18:43,670 --> 00:18:41,490
deck sometimes during the break for

402
00:18:48,230 --> 00:18:43,680
instance one of the gentlemen said that

403
00:18:53,990 --> 00:18:48,240
he saw the object as a he said that it

404
00:18:56,120 --> 00:18:54,000
was a a formation of lights and he

405
00:18:59,950 --> 00:18:56,130
described it as being part of the same

406
00:19:03,650 --> 00:18:59,960
object not necessarily three distinct

407
00:19:05,920 --> 00:19:03,660
UFOs but one object that he described it

408
00:19:09,980 --> 00:19:05,930
as a triangular formation running lights

409
00:19:12,730 --> 00:19:09,990
and he said that in his mind he thought

410
00:19:15,260 --> 00:19:12,740
you know this might be some type of

411
00:19:18,590 --> 00:19:15,270
aircraft it's part of the strike group

412
00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:18,600
but then the way that it moved and the

413
00:19:22,940 --> 00:19:21,330
fact that there was no sound really

414
00:19:25,100 --> 00:19:22,950
startled him because he said that in

415
00:19:28,070 --> 00:19:25,110
other cases when any aircraft a

416
00:19:29,570 --> 00:19:28,080
helicopter or jet or airplane was near

417
00:19:30,860 --> 00:19:29,580
the Princeton where they could see the

418
00:19:33,770 --> 00:19:30,870
running lights for instance they would

419
00:19:35,690 --> 00:19:33,780
also be able to hear the aircraft in

420
00:19:38,180 --> 00:19:35,700
this case he said that he couldn't hear

421
00:19:40,580 --> 00:19:38,190
it he said that the way that it moved

422
00:19:42,710 --> 00:19:40,590
and that was the second part was really

423
00:19:45,140 --> 00:19:42,720
startling because he said that it wasn't

424
00:19:46,910 --> 00:19:45,150
moving in a trajectory that an aircraft

425
00:19:48,500 --> 00:19:46,920
would normally move it which would be

426
00:19:50,630 --> 00:19:48,510
like if it had a propulsion source that

427
00:19:52,130 --> 00:19:50,640
was moving forward or banking or

428
00:19:54,770 --> 00:19:52,140
whatever it said that the object was

429
00:19:58,810 --> 00:19:54,780
sort of sliding or skidding

430
00:20:02,510 --> 00:19:58,820
so it could go forward or laterally

431
00:20:05,360 --> 00:20:02,520
almost like he said if you look at the

432
00:20:07,730 --> 00:20:05,370
racing drones of today on the way that

433
00:20:10,850 --> 00:20:07,740
they move I'm in the sky like a drum of

434
00:20:12,380 --> 00:20:10,860
you know a racing drone that that's sort

435
00:20:14,750 --> 00:20:12,390
of the type of movement he was seeing

436
00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:14,760
but this was back in 2004 when they

437
00:20:18,500 --> 00:20:16,890
hadn't even really heard of drones at

438
00:20:20,990 --> 00:20:18,510
that time they were so new so and he

439
00:20:23,120 --> 00:20:21,000
said that the size of it was way bigger

440
00:20:25,730 --> 00:20:23,130
than anything like like that you know it

441
00:20:28,310 --> 00:20:25,740
was pretty big I asked him how how far

442
00:20:31,580 --> 00:20:28,320
away or how baby any study he really

443
00:20:33,770 --> 00:20:31,590
couldn't give me a good estimate of you

444
00:20:35,990 --> 00:20:33,780
know exactly how far away it was but I

445
00:20:37,910 --> 00:20:36,000
thought that was very interesting I

446
00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:37,920
hadn't heard anyone else actually give

447
00:20:43,280 --> 00:20:41,010
me a description of an object with three

448
00:20:46,370 --> 00:20:43,290
lights on it like that

449
00:20:47,490 --> 00:20:46,380
now the other witness also worked at

450
00:20:50,220 --> 00:20:47,500
night he was

451
00:20:53,310 --> 00:20:50,230
yeah real real quick data let me jump in

452
00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:53,320
with a question about that did these

453
00:20:57,450 --> 00:20:55,450
witnesses that have contacted you were

454
00:21:00,389 --> 00:20:57,460
they aware that something unusual was

455
00:21:03,269 --> 00:21:00,399
going on when they saw the when they had

456
00:21:06,419 --> 00:21:03,279
their sightings yes it's my

457
00:21:11,249 --> 00:21:06,429
understanding that in the beginning when

458
00:21:13,379 --> 00:21:11,259
the CIC had these tracks that they the

459
00:21:15,090 --> 00:21:13,389
the crew didn't believe them at first

460
00:21:19,560 --> 00:21:15,100
they thought that there was a system

461
00:21:21,269 --> 00:21:19,570
malfunction so say if November 14th is

462
00:21:23,279 --> 00:21:21,279
when they sent out an intercept to find

463
00:21:25,769 --> 00:21:23,289
out what they were if you go back before

464
00:21:27,090 --> 00:21:25,779
that a few days the crew didn't know

465
00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:27,100
what they were looking at they thought

466
00:21:30,269 --> 00:21:28,570
there was some kind of problem with the

467
00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:30,279
radar that's really what was happening

468
00:21:36,029 --> 00:21:33,490
but then on the 14th during the daytime

469
00:21:39,119 --> 00:21:36,039
that's when they finally sent out Kevin

470
00:21:41,249 --> 00:21:39,129
had one of his crew members send

471
00:21:42,720 --> 00:21:41,259
commander framers flight out to take a

472
00:21:44,940 --> 00:21:42,730
look and that's when they had the visual

473
00:21:47,490 --> 00:21:44,950
right so I believe that when these guys

474
00:21:49,769 --> 00:21:47,500
saw these objects in the sky it was

475
00:21:52,019 --> 00:21:49,779
either that night or the next night or

476
00:21:54,090 --> 00:21:52,029
the next night is from what they said

477
00:21:57,720 --> 00:21:54,100
this sort of went on for a few days

478
00:22:00,600 --> 00:21:57,730
after commander favors you know eyeballs

479
00:22:02,850 --> 00:22:00,610
on the object and Kevin said that he had

480
00:22:06,409 --> 00:22:02,860
been get up again trade our targets for

481
00:22:11,610 --> 00:22:06,419
a number of days before the intercepts

482
00:22:13,350 --> 00:22:11,620
Yeah right in that they said that they

483
00:22:15,269 --> 00:22:13,360
were wreaking and they were taking the

484
00:22:16,710 --> 00:22:15,279
system down and bringing it back up

485
00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:16,720
trying to find out if there was some

486
00:22:20,730 --> 00:22:18,970
type of a radar anomaly who the aegis

487
00:22:22,710 --> 00:22:20,740
system that was causing false returns

488
00:22:24,090 --> 00:22:22,720
they found out that that was not the

489
00:22:27,299 --> 00:22:24,100
case that the radar seemed to be

490
00:22:29,639 --> 00:22:27,309
functioning perfectly and then so now

491
00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:29,649
they have the intercept and of course we

492
00:22:34,680 --> 00:22:31,690
know that there were two intercepts that

493
00:22:37,399 --> 00:22:34,690
went down one of the things that both of

494
00:22:39,779 --> 00:22:37,409
these guys independently told me and

495
00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:39,789
this is sort of new information that

496
00:22:46,560 --> 00:22:43,330
came out that after that that there was

497
00:22:48,180 --> 00:22:46,570
a briefing on USS nimitz with a lot of

498
00:22:50,730 --> 00:22:48,190
the people that were involved in this

499
00:22:54,710 --> 00:22:50,740
and these were would be more senior

500
00:22:57,149 --> 00:22:54,720
officers lead petty officers and so on

501
00:22:58,680 --> 00:22:57,159
they would be like sort of the bosses of

502
00:23:01,420 --> 00:22:58,690
the ships and he said that there were

503
00:23:03,880 --> 00:23:01,430
some people from USS

504
00:23:05,860 --> 00:23:03,890
and that ferried over to USS nimitz

505
00:23:08,020 --> 00:23:05,870
where this briefing took place with

506
00:23:10,930 --> 00:23:08,030
captain of USS nimitz and also like an

507
00:23:12,160 --> 00:23:10,940
admiral i think and he said that that

508
00:23:15,490 --> 00:23:12,170
there were probably eight to ten people

509
00:23:16,150 --> 00:23:15,500
there and this guy said the pilots had

510
00:23:17,470 --> 00:23:16,160
to be there

511
00:23:19,390 --> 00:23:17,480
commander flavor had to be in this

512
00:23:22,710 --> 00:23:19,400
meeting and in the meeting it was

513
00:23:26,050 --> 00:23:22,720
discussed that what the story would be

514
00:23:28,990 --> 00:23:26,060
if anyone asks about this is that what

515
00:23:33,210 --> 00:23:29,000
they were seeing what was iced crystals

516
00:23:35,590 --> 00:23:33,220
that were refracting off of the radars

517
00:23:37,510 --> 00:23:35,600
and of course somebody brought up the

518
00:23:40,510 --> 00:23:37,520
fact all you know that doesn't make

519
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:40,520
sense that you know ice crystal can go

520
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:43,610
from a hover to six hundred knots in one

521
00:23:46,870 --> 00:23:45,170
second you know and they were all

522
00:23:50,530 --> 00:23:46,880
laughing or whatever but if you have to

523
00:23:52,120 --> 00:23:50,540
realize that at this time no video had

524
00:23:54,190 --> 00:23:52,130
ever been leaked of any of this no one

525
00:23:56,260 --> 00:23:54,200
the outside world didn't know any of

526
00:23:58,090 --> 00:23:56,270
this stuff so they're saying if anyone

527
00:24:00,130 --> 00:23:58,100
asks on the ships about what's going on

528
00:24:04,030 --> 00:24:00,140
just this is what we're gonna tell

529
00:24:05,860 --> 00:24:04,040
everybody so here i have like at least

530
00:24:07,990 --> 00:24:05,870
two independent witnesses that are

531
00:24:12,750 --> 00:24:08,000
saying this and though the one gentleman

532
00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:12,760
his job he was a cryptographic

533
00:24:20,470 --> 00:24:18,010
technician see if I have what he said

534
00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:20,480
but I know he's a he worked in the

535
00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:24,170
ship's signal exploitation space on USS

536
00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:27,770
Princeton called the SAS and that may be

537
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:30,050
a little familiar because that's where

538
00:24:34,390 --> 00:24:32,090
Jason Turner özil said that he had

539
00:24:37,870 --> 00:24:34,400
witnessed a video in a place called the

540
00:24:40,930 --> 00:24:37,880
SAS but this say this shipmate said that

541
00:24:44,880 --> 00:24:40,940
he worked in the SAS and he is the one

542
00:24:47,620 --> 00:24:44,890
who told me that his week petty officer

543
00:24:50,380 --> 00:24:47,630
went over two minutes to attend this

544
00:24:52,150 --> 00:24:50,390
briefing and when they came back they

545
00:24:57,730 --> 00:24:52,160
kind of explained it crew what was going

546
00:25:00,160 --> 00:24:57,740
on he also saw in his email a similar

547
00:25:02,770 --> 00:25:00,170
statement that said you know it was

548
00:25:05,080 --> 00:25:02,780
basically an email with the video that

549
00:25:07,120 --> 00:25:05,090
we've all seen the FLIR one video this

550
00:25:08,260 --> 00:25:07,130
is the email that a lot of the witness

551
00:25:11,020 --> 00:25:08,270
talk about they saw on the computer

552
00:25:12,820 --> 00:25:11,030
systems and he said that the email said

553
00:25:14,790 --> 00:25:12,830
you know if anyone asked about what this

554
00:25:17,640 --> 00:25:14,800
was it's ice crystals but

555
00:25:21,630 --> 00:25:17,650
here's the real day and then they have

556
00:25:23,970 --> 00:25:21,640
this video attached to it so you know I

557
00:25:26,430 --> 00:25:23,980
mean that's kind of new information guys

558
00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:26,440
I haven't heard anyone else mentioned

559
00:25:30,210 --> 00:25:28,330
that ever including commando flavour

560
00:25:33,870 --> 00:25:30,220
never mentioned anything about a

561
00:25:35,490 --> 00:25:33,880
briefing where they were told that this

562
00:25:38,070 --> 00:25:35,500
is these were ice crystals that's the

563
00:25:39,780 --> 00:25:38,080
cover story or apparently that this

564
00:25:41,730 --> 00:25:39,790
video was it must have been fairly

565
00:25:45,120 --> 00:25:41,740
widely disseminated depending on how

566
00:25:47,820 --> 00:25:45,130
many people got this email yeah the guy

567
00:25:49,410 --> 00:25:47,830
that I'm talking to you I mean both of

568
00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:49,420
these guys the one that was the

569
00:25:55,560 --> 00:25:52,570
cryptographic technician and also the

570
00:25:57,900 --> 00:25:55,570
other watch stander he worked in the CIC

571
00:26:00,240 --> 00:25:57,910
which would have been you know the

572
00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:00,250
command center on Princeton where Kevin

573
00:26:04,890 --> 00:26:03,250
day you knew who this guy was Gary or

574
00:26:09,570 --> 00:26:04,900
piece and so on

575
00:26:12,030 --> 00:26:09,580
they were both aware of the briefing you

576
00:26:14,850 --> 00:26:12,040
know so it's sort of interesting now

577
00:26:16,380 --> 00:26:14,860
we've never heard anyone say you know

578
00:26:18,270 --> 00:26:16,390
like a man framer though this was ice

579
00:26:20,700 --> 00:26:18,280
crystals but I think that that was the

580
00:26:22,530 --> 00:26:20,710
story that was being told to the other

581
00:26:24,930 --> 00:26:22,540
enlisted guys are finding it was any

582
00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:24,940
curiosity seekers on the ships and the

583
00:26:29,250 --> 00:26:27,250
scuttlebutt and so on to kind of tamp it

584
00:26:30,510 --> 00:26:29,260
down and not talk about what was really

585
00:26:32,940 --> 00:26:30,520
going on now

586
00:26:35,700 --> 00:26:32,950
I'll interject that this gentleman that

587
00:26:38,580 --> 00:26:35,710
I'm talking to set he firmly believes

588
00:26:41,310 --> 00:26:38,590
that this was some type of secret test

589
00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:41,320
platform I mean he doesn't have evidence

590
00:26:45,750 --> 00:26:44,050
you know conclusively but he was saying

591
00:26:48,390 --> 00:26:45,760
you know based on everything he's

592
00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:48,400
looking at in the way that his kind of

593
00:26:52,770 --> 00:26:50,890
deductive reasoning Coast town he thinks

594
00:26:58,080 --> 00:26:52,780
that it might have actually been some

595
00:26:59,520 --> 00:26:58,090
type of secret test platform and you

596
00:27:01,610 --> 00:26:59,530
know he goes through all his reasoning

597
00:27:05,130 --> 00:27:01,620
of why you know versus an

598
00:27:08,280 --> 00:27:05,140
extraterrestrial craft so what were some

599
00:27:10,260 --> 00:27:08,290
of his reasons well I mean first of all

600
00:27:13,380 --> 00:27:10,270
he said based on his own observations he

601
00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:13,390
thought that maybe what he saw almost

602
00:27:18,650 --> 00:27:16,090
looked like some type of VTOL or

603
00:27:22,260 --> 00:27:18,660
vertical takeoff and landing type of

604
00:27:24,390 --> 00:27:22,270
aircraft you said it moved unlike

605
00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:24,400
anything he's seen before didn't really

606
00:27:28,430 --> 00:27:26,770
and he also didn't have much noise and

607
00:27:30,170 --> 00:27:28,440
then he goes on to talk

608
00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:30,180
but a lot of the stuff that fray versed

609
00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:33,450
and in his contention would be that mate

610
00:27:39,470 --> 00:27:37,170
maybe braver basically as part of us et

611
00:27:42,140 --> 00:27:39,480
cover story he said why would somebody

612
00:27:44,870 --> 00:27:42,150
kind of lean in that direction versus

613
00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:44,880
first leaning towards that this could be

614
00:27:50,300 --> 00:27:47,850
some some type of craft that we have

615
00:27:53,570 --> 00:27:50,310
that maybe is a test platform or some

616
00:27:55,910 --> 00:27:53,580
type of very highly secretive project

617
00:27:57,580 --> 00:27:55,920
that's going on and that if a number

618
00:27:59,720 --> 00:27:57,590
does leak out to the public then

619
00:28:00,920 --> 00:27:59,730
immediately jumping on and going forward

620
00:28:03,980 --> 00:28:00,930
with oh we don't have anything like this

621
00:28:07,370 --> 00:28:03,990
and it must be an ET thing it's not

622
00:28:09,260 --> 00:28:07,380
owned by us could be part of a cover

623
00:28:12,500 --> 00:28:09,270
that would be easy thing to do and you

624
00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:12,510
have a highly-decorated maybe pilot

625
00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:14,610
you know commander going out no one's

626
00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:16,890
gonna question him and if anybody like

627
00:28:21,380 --> 00:28:19,650
an enlisted guy you know or even a

628
00:28:23,990 --> 00:28:21,390
senior chief comes forward and says no

629
00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:24,000
that's you know I I saw this and it

630
00:28:27,830 --> 00:28:25,650
doesn't kind of line up with what you're

631
00:28:29,930 --> 00:28:27,840
saying and then he immediately says no

632
00:28:32,420 --> 00:28:29,940
that didn't happen no one came aboard

633
00:28:34,850 --> 00:28:32,430
the ships to take anything there was no

634
00:28:39,620 --> 00:28:34,860
cover-up no no men in black showed up to

635
00:28:43,460 --> 00:28:39,630
take data away and so on so yeah we've

636
00:28:45,530 --> 00:28:43,470
heard that story that floated around the

637
00:28:47,350 --> 00:28:45,540
UFO community for a long time regarding

638
00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:47,360
that topic you just brought up which is

639
00:28:54,980 --> 00:28:51,330
men and blacks so to speak showing up at

640
00:28:56,930 --> 00:28:54,990
the ship to take material away that was

641
00:28:59,600 --> 00:28:56,940
video related or anything related to

642
00:29:01,340 --> 00:28:59,610
that tick-tack topic well it was a

643
00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:01,350
little bit more specific than that that

644
00:29:07,490 --> 00:29:04,170
PJ PJ Hughes was saying that that was an

645
00:29:11,540 --> 00:29:07,500
Air Force personnel right yeah yeah

646
00:29:13,850 --> 00:29:11,550
right and Gary or he said gentleman

647
00:29:16,340 --> 00:29:13,860
showed up in plainclothes and came in

648
00:29:20,420 --> 00:29:16,350
and he they they boarded the ship on a

649
00:29:22,250 --> 00:29:20,430
helicopter and he had to sign out the

650
00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:22,260
tape recordings in a race everything

651
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:25,170
that was left over I had the witness

652
00:29:30,110 --> 00:29:27,810
Ryan wide out the helicopter detachment

653
00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:30,120
I say the key witness these guys come

654
00:29:35,020 --> 00:29:32,490
aboard and take everything but then you

655
00:29:36,980 --> 00:29:35,030
have the pilots on the other hand

656
00:29:39,230 --> 00:29:36,990
discrediting all that I mean claiming

657
00:29:42,140 --> 00:29:39,240
it's you know that this did not happen

658
00:29:43,820 --> 00:29:42,150
it's a falsehood these guys are making

659
00:29:46,370 --> 00:29:43,830
they're insinuating that they're lying

660
00:29:48,530 --> 00:29:46,380
or embellishing or making it all up but

661
00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:48,540
yet you know when I have like five

662
00:29:51,770 --> 00:29:50,250
different people all saying the same

663
00:29:55,130 --> 00:29:51,780
thing sometimes you start saying well

664
00:29:57,560 --> 00:29:55,140
maybe maybe it was unrelated to tic-tac

665
00:30:00,590 --> 00:29:57,570
but I think it really did happen and

666
00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:00,600
that was one one of the things that the

667
00:30:04,130 --> 00:30:02,250
cryptographic technician brought up he's

668
00:30:07,520 --> 00:30:04,140
saying why would why would he

669
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:07,530
investigate that further if say commando

670
00:30:11,710 --> 00:30:09,090
freighter was more open-minded and

671
00:30:14,450 --> 00:30:11,720
didn't know what this really was

672
00:30:17,510 --> 00:30:14,460
go ahead yeah why when you look into

673
00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:17,520
like all sides of the equation and

674
00:30:21,830 --> 00:30:19,290
really try to find out who are these

675
00:30:23,270 --> 00:30:21,840
guys on the Princeton saying that guys

676
00:30:26,510 --> 00:30:23,280
came aboard wouldn't you want to find

677
00:30:28,490 --> 00:30:26,520
out and ask him more about that say hey

678
00:30:30,590 --> 00:30:28,500
I didn't I didn't experience that in my

679
00:30:33,980 --> 00:30:30,600
squadron but why did you experience it

680
00:30:36,350 --> 00:30:33,990
who are you who was your you know chain

681
00:30:37,850 --> 00:30:36,360
of command and try to explore it a

682
00:30:40,730 --> 00:30:37,860
little bit more versus just shutting

683
00:30:43,850 --> 00:30:40,740
them down and almost like I'm the story

684
00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:43,860
I'm the only story only listen to what

685
00:30:49,070 --> 00:30:46,890
I'm saying so he was sort of suspicious

686
00:30:51,530 --> 00:30:49,080
the the witness was sort of suspicious

687
00:30:55,670 --> 00:30:51,540
of that thinking that maybe he was using

688
00:30:58,040 --> 00:30:55,680
his position to you know promote only

689
00:30:59,960 --> 00:30:58,050
one story and everything else is false

690
00:31:01,760 --> 00:30:59,970
now again I have no evidence that's the

691
00:31:03,710 --> 00:31:01,770
case and maybe the elements that he does

692
00:31:06,230 --> 00:31:03,720
believe that if these were craft that

693
00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:06,240
were from you know outside of you know

694
00:31:10,850 --> 00:31:08,610
our capabilities and any other of our

695
00:31:13,610 --> 00:31:10,860
adversaries technological capabilities

696
00:31:16,550 --> 00:31:13,620
right so I don't wanted to bring up the

697
00:31:18,620 --> 00:31:16,560
human element here to a Christian

698
00:31:22,100 --> 00:31:18,630
Lambright believe that you majored in

699
00:31:24,290 --> 00:31:22,110
psychology wanted to ask you if there's

700
00:31:27,380 --> 00:31:24,300
a group of people that really did

701
00:31:30,170 --> 00:31:27,390
witness something and they're being

702
00:31:32,630 --> 00:31:30,180
rejected publicly and being told that

703
00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:32,640
their story isn't true what are they

704
00:31:37,630 --> 00:31:34,410
supposed to do to convince the whole

705
00:31:42,290 --> 00:31:37,640
world they know what they saw

706
00:31:44,990 --> 00:31:42,300
well there are parallels to this in a

707
00:31:46,670 --> 00:31:45,000
lot of events one that came up and

708
00:31:48,710 --> 00:31:46,680
material I was reading recently goes

709
00:31:50,120 --> 00:31:48,720
even all the way back to the to the

710
00:31:51,590 --> 00:31:50,130
cattle mutilation days where the

711
00:31:55,940 --> 00:31:51,600
investigators going out talking to the

712
00:31:57,740 --> 00:31:55,950
ranchers and leaving the ranchers

713
00:31:59,389 --> 00:31:57,750
convinced these guys are laughing at us

714
00:32:02,180 --> 00:31:59,399
and telling us we're all fools and we

715
00:32:03,799 --> 00:32:02,190
don't know what predators would do as

716
00:32:05,060 --> 00:32:03,809
opposed to what we're seeing now and

717
00:32:07,129 --> 00:32:05,070
ultimately the ranchers don't talk to

718
00:32:08,930 --> 00:32:07,139
anybody else they will not talk to any

719
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:08,940
more investigators they're sick of being

720
00:32:15,950 --> 00:32:13,250
treated that way this does tend to

721
00:32:17,990 --> 00:32:15,960
especially if you pick up on how someone

722
00:32:19,879 --> 00:32:18,000
you know has been treated or feels

723
00:32:24,039 --> 00:32:19,889
they've been treated you don't want to

724
00:32:27,350 --> 00:32:24,049
get into it yourself so effectively by

725
00:32:31,820 --> 00:32:27,360
shouting down or trying to diminish or

726
00:32:34,759 --> 00:32:31,830
demean anybody else's testimony it makes

727
00:32:37,159 --> 00:32:34,769
other people not want to get in to it

728
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:37,169
they don't want to get involved and you

729
00:32:41,330 --> 00:32:38,730
know that's the whole thing if you don't

730
00:32:43,759 --> 00:32:41,340
believe me I'm out of here

731
00:32:45,830 --> 00:32:43,769
that's what I would take I will jump in

732
00:32:53,539 --> 00:32:45,840
here and say this because when we did

733
00:32:56,330 --> 00:32:53,549
have a Jason @pj and Kevin and no I'm

734
00:33:00,200 --> 00:32:56,340
forgetting at Jason PJ Kevin and Gary

735
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:00,210
when we had to all them on the show you

736
00:33:04,220 --> 00:33:02,490
know I asked him specifically a negative

737
00:33:06,019 --> 00:33:04,230
feedback anything along those lines and

738
00:33:08,060 --> 00:33:06,029
they were unanimous so it's been a

739
00:33:10,610 --> 00:33:08,070
positive for them so at least in this

740
00:33:11,990 --> 00:33:10,620
particular case you know I have no

741
00:33:14,060 --> 00:33:12,000
doubts that a lot of it is because of

742
00:33:16,610 --> 00:33:14,070
who they are and the fact that they're

743
00:33:19,639 --> 00:33:16,620
highly trained let me finish chant let

744
00:33:22,610 --> 00:33:19,649
me finish that in their particular

745
00:33:24,049 --> 00:33:22,620
instance in their particular case they

746
00:33:26,450 --> 00:33:24,059
haven't gotten anything like that at

747
00:33:28,279 --> 00:33:26,460
least you know they were pretty positive

748
00:33:30,350 --> 00:33:28,289
about the experience and glad that they

749
00:33:32,899 --> 00:33:30,360
came forward so there's that in this

750
00:33:35,090 --> 00:33:32,909
particular case but they were positive

751
00:33:37,820 --> 00:33:35,100
when we interviewed them then we have no

752
00:33:39,620 --> 00:33:37,830
idea a year later how they feel now Dave

753
00:33:42,259 --> 00:33:39,630
do you have any input on that yeah I

754
00:33:44,930 --> 00:33:42,269
mean I think that it's been a very

755
00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:44,940
positive experience for them as sort of

756
00:33:51,139 --> 00:33:48,570
a way for them to on basically I have

757
00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:51,149
seen a transformation from you know

758
00:33:55,190 --> 00:33:53,250
these guys when I first met them they

759
00:33:57,259 --> 00:33:55,200
didn't have any knowledge of UFO

760
00:34:00,440 --> 00:33:57,269
community really for the most part or

761
00:34:02,060 --> 00:34:00,450
any interest in it well I you know over

762
00:34:04,879 --> 00:34:02,070
the last year they've really blossomed

763
00:34:07,250 --> 00:34:04,889
then each one of them has sort of taken

764
00:34:08,119 --> 00:34:07,260
on this role of trying to help explain

765
00:34:09,680 --> 00:34:08,129
what they saw

766
00:34:12,230 --> 00:34:09,690
you know

767
00:34:15,669 --> 00:34:12,240
they did really honestly want to bridge

768
00:34:18,260 --> 00:34:15,679
that gap with the pilots and in try to

769
00:34:20,210 --> 00:34:18,270
come to some middle ground at least I

770
00:34:23,180 --> 00:34:20,220
even tried to I did a conference call

771
00:34:24,980 --> 00:34:23,190
with the former fighter pilot Paco

772
00:34:27,349 --> 00:34:24,990
Teresa you wrote that original article

773
00:34:28,909 --> 00:34:27,359
I'd I did a conference call with these

774
00:34:31,579 --> 00:34:28,919
guys just off the record where I was

775
00:34:34,490 --> 00:34:31,589
trying to see if I could get him to ask

776
00:34:36,980 --> 00:34:34,500
some questions maybe to open up and but

777
00:34:40,760 --> 00:34:36,990
it was I found that it was it was sort

778
00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:40,770
of the that's were really the enlisted

779
00:34:45,139 --> 00:34:42,450
vets were really want they didn't want

780
00:34:47,299 --> 00:34:45,149
to talk about it but you know I think

781
00:34:49,010 --> 00:34:47,309
that it was a closed-minded situation

782
00:34:51,260 --> 00:34:49,020
where there was no question that they

783
00:34:53,720 --> 00:34:51,270
were wrong and that's just the way it is

784
00:34:56,180 --> 00:34:53,730
that hey you know Dave baby you want to

785
00:34:58,069 --> 00:34:56,190
believe these guys man I understand that

786
00:35:00,250 --> 00:34:58,079
but they're wrong that was kind of the

787
00:35:03,710 --> 00:35:00,260
feeling I got from it it was just

788
00:35:05,240 --> 00:35:03,720
closed-door now I don't I think that

789
00:35:07,819 --> 00:35:05,250
those guys have just moved on from that

790
00:35:09,410 --> 00:35:07,829
they're like hey if you won't say that

791
00:35:12,020 --> 00:35:09,420
or you know if you want to believe that

792
00:35:14,420 --> 00:35:12,030
that's your belief that we were there

793
00:35:17,000 --> 00:35:14,430
this is what we experienced and they

794
00:35:19,069 --> 00:35:17,010
sort of created this do United Front so

795
00:35:20,390 --> 00:35:19,079
to speak and I've actually seen that

796
00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:20,400
some of these guys coming forward like

797
00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:22,170
the guy that I just talked about the

798
00:35:27,289 --> 00:35:24,930
cryptographic technician he felt really

799
00:35:29,359 --> 00:35:27,299
bad that there was that these pilots

800
00:35:32,359 --> 00:35:29,369
that were sort of going out and talking

801
00:35:35,089 --> 00:35:32,369
down about enlisted crewmen and he

802
00:35:37,069 --> 00:35:35,099
wanted to come forward simply to

803
00:35:39,920 --> 00:35:37,079
basically support what they saw because

804
00:35:41,390 --> 00:35:39,930
he was like hey I was there and I saw

805
00:35:43,190 --> 00:35:41,400
the same thing I witnessed the same

806
00:35:46,099 --> 00:35:43,200
thing that week so it was pretty

807
00:35:48,079 --> 00:35:46,109
interesting to to have that but we're

808
00:35:50,750 --> 00:35:48,089
really yep chant chant let me jump in

809
00:35:53,329 --> 00:35:50,760
here really was that it was just flavor

810
00:35:55,370 --> 00:35:53,339
at the the McMinnville conference that

811
00:35:58,400 --> 00:35:55,380
happened at some point last year I can't

812
00:36:00,559 --> 00:35:58,410
remember exactly when but let's see I

813
00:36:03,109 --> 00:36:00,569
believe it's a Kurth is really not

814
00:36:04,519 --> 00:36:03,119
saying anything and Chad Underwood

815
00:36:07,130 --> 00:36:04,529
really didn't say that much either was

816
00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:07,140
really only flavor at that at that one

817
00:36:12,319 --> 00:36:09,170
instance and to be honest with you that

818
00:36:14,660 --> 00:36:12,329
really did not get much in the way of

819
00:36:17,900 --> 00:36:14,670
legs outside of the the real niche

820
00:36:20,510 --> 00:36:17,910
hardcore UFO community well yeah but he

821
00:36:23,030 --> 00:36:20,520
also went after them like on Joe Rogan

822
00:36:25,430 --> 00:36:23,040
so that had quite a few

823
00:36:27,380 --> 00:36:25,440
negative applications for those guys but

824
00:36:29,240 --> 00:36:27,390
I mean again like I said they kind of

825
00:36:30,290 --> 00:36:29,250
brush it off and say look you don't have

826
00:36:34,940 --> 00:36:30,300
to believe me

827
00:36:36,380 --> 00:36:34,950
you know we saw you know they're in even

828
00:36:38,750 --> 00:36:36,390
with some of the witnesses that have

829
00:36:40,070 --> 00:36:38,760
come forward that have differing in and

830
00:36:41,720 --> 00:36:40,080
I'm not talking about the pilots that

831
00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:41,730
have different recollections for

832
00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:44,010
instance these guys don't recall seeing

833
00:36:49,580 --> 00:36:47,130
multiple tracks on the new guys that I'm

834
00:36:52,190 --> 00:36:49,590
talking to you they say they were aware

835
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:52,200
of one or two tracks of UFOs and when

836
00:36:57,260 --> 00:36:54,570
they were tracked it was one object if

837
00:36:59,990 --> 00:36:57,270
you recall Cavan mentions groups of five

838
00:37:02,180 --> 00:37:00,000
to ten objects first yeah they were

839
00:37:06,110 --> 00:37:02,190
adding up over a period of time to like

840
00:37:07,940 --> 00:37:06,120
a hundred or so right and they say they

841
00:37:10,760 --> 00:37:07,950
didn't witness that at all they were

842
00:37:12,830 --> 00:37:10,770
aware of one or two UFOs during the

843
00:37:17,770 --> 00:37:12,840
entire week that were actually tracked

844
00:37:20,750 --> 00:37:17,780
on radar so I wanted to mention after a

845
00:37:24,320 --> 00:37:20,760
sort of that debacle or seemingly

846
00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:24,330
negative situation when favor denied the

847
00:37:33,490 --> 00:37:32,420
it seemed like right after that or

848
00:37:37,250 --> 00:37:33,500
shortly thereafter

849
00:37:39,410 --> 00:37:37,260
you took your wonderful USS Nimitz

850
00:37:42,500 --> 00:37:39,420
encounter documentary that you worked so

851
00:37:46,370 --> 00:37:42,510
hard on which was is an award-winning

852
00:37:48,260 --> 00:37:46,380
documentary off of Amazon you'll have to

853
00:37:50,900 --> 00:37:48,270
correct me later if I'm wrong which got

854
00:37:52,850 --> 00:37:50,910
millions of views and you went ahead and

855
00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:52,860
did something after that with it can you

856
00:38:00,410 --> 00:37:56,090
please fill us in on what you did yeah

857
00:38:03,950 --> 00:38:00,420
you know back then I didn't really like

858
00:38:09,050 --> 00:38:03,960
publicize this too much because you know

859
00:38:11,630 --> 00:38:09,060
sort of a professional thing but in the

860
00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:11,640
very beginning I had asked for

861
00:38:16,850 --> 00:38:14,610
permission to use a short snippet from

862
00:38:18,650 --> 00:38:16,860
commander framer that had been recorded

863
00:38:21,020 --> 00:38:18,660
by to the Stars Academy and I got

864
00:38:24,830 --> 00:38:21,030
permission through their you know

865
00:38:26,380 --> 00:38:24,840
marketing people basically and they said

866
00:38:28,820 --> 00:38:26,390
you know I could use a little bit

867
00:38:31,280 --> 00:38:28,830
fast-forward after the video went live

868
00:38:33,080 --> 00:38:31,290
and again Who am I I'm just a guy in the

869
00:38:35,540 --> 00:38:33,090
Internet I'm not the History Channel I'm

870
00:38:36,650 --> 00:38:35,550
not you know Discovery Channel and a

871
00:38:38,660 --> 00:38:36,660
little guy that

872
00:38:42,020 --> 00:38:38,670
no one's ever heard of puts a video up

873
00:38:44,630 --> 00:38:42,030
on youtube so two months later it had

874
00:38:47,510 --> 00:38:44,640
over a million views and I guess that

875
00:38:49,490 --> 00:38:47,520
caught the attention of commander flavor

876
00:38:51,260 --> 00:38:49,500
or somebody emailed it to them you know

877
00:38:54,380 --> 00:38:51,270
how that works somebody sees it and says

878
00:38:56,990 --> 00:38:54,390
hey did you see this and I guess he took

879
00:38:59,150 --> 00:38:57,000
issue with the fact that I used his

880
00:39:02,210 --> 00:38:59,160
interview without his specific

881
00:39:03,920 --> 00:39:02,220
permission and I did try to even contact

882
00:39:05,210 --> 00:39:03,930
him at the time but I never looked

883
00:39:08,359 --> 00:39:05,220
successful in getting through dan

884
00:39:10,549 --> 00:39:08,369
actually wouldn't really be his place to

885
00:39:12,109 --> 00:39:10,559
do that it's at he's the stars Academy

886
00:39:15,039 --> 00:39:12,119
cut it they gave you the permission and

887
00:39:17,270 --> 00:39:15,049
you got it right it wouldn't they were

888
00:39:19,819 --> 00:39:17,280
Russian companies so they were doing

889
00:39:22,670 --> 00:39:19,829
that in essence before they did their

890
00:39:24,500 --> 00:39:22,680
show on identify but I got an email from

891
00:39:26,690 --> 00:39:24,510
their attorney saying that commander

892
00:39:29,270 --> 00:39:26,700
flavor is demanding that I removed this

893
00:39:30,950 --> 00:39:29,280
clip that they they didn't mention that

894
00:39:33,079 --> 00:39:30,960
I that they I had already given me

895
00:39:35,420 --> 00:39:33,089
permission so I wrote back and go you

896
00:39:38,150 --> 00:39:35,430
got this gaming permission you know what

897
00:39:40,069 --> 00:39:38,160
why if you put this in writing you know

898
00:39:41,450 --> 00:39:40,079
put it in writing or give me a call I

899
00:39:43,250 --> 00:39:41,460
mean that was the thing that got me is

900
00:39:45,109 --> 00:39:43,260
why didn't they just pick up the phone

901
00:39:46,670 --> 00:39:45,119
instead of having their attorney come

902
00:39:49,190 --> 00:39:46,680
after me or whatever I thought that was

903
00:39:51,289 --> 00:39:49,200
sort of to me a little unprofessional I

904
00:39:53,240 --> 00:39:51,299
would have used if you guys put a video

905
00:39:55,640 --> 00:39:53,250
up I would just call you and say hey you

906
00:39:57,019 --> 00:39:55,650
know what's going on you know can you

907
00:39:59,150 --> 00:39:57,029
take that down on a like it or whatever

908
00:40:01,670 --> 00:39:59,160
but you know saw in the end I just

909
00:40:04,099 --> 00:40:01,680
agreed I'm like look I'm not gonna fight

910
00:40:06,319 --> 00:40:04,109
you guys over this little snippet I just

911
00:40:08,029 --> 00:40:06,329
took it out of my film and I just

912
00:40:11,180 --> 00:40:08,039
instead of having commander framers

913
00:40:12,799 --> 00:40:11,190
basically in his own words saying for a

914
00:40:16,190 --> 00:40:12,809
minute or two what he saw I just

915
00:40:19,010 --> 00:40:16,200
paraphrased it so the narrator says the

916
00:40:20,990 --> 00:40:19,020
exact same thing but without it coming

917
00:40:22,250 --> 00:40:21,000
out of his mouth you see so I don't all

918
00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:22,260
right I don't face a copyright

919
00:40:27,710 --> 00:40:24,450
infringement or whatever they exactly

920
00:40:29,150 --> 00:40:27,720
mean exactly so you know it was a little

921
00:40:32,569 --> 00:40:29,160
stuffed back but to be honest with you

922
00:40:35,329 --> 00:40:32,579
mmm at that time I had the four

923
00:40:36,829 --> 00:40:35,339
interviews with the new witnesses so the

924
00:40:38,720 --> 00:40:36,839
filament was better I thought because

925
00:40:42,220 --> 00:40:38,730
instead of just one witnessed I ended up

926
00:40:44,990 --> 00:40:42,230
adding four new guys to the film and

927
00:40:47,210 --> 00:40:45,000
while maybe not having the pilots

928
00:40:49,339 --> 00:40:47,220
testimony was a little you know but

929
00:40:50,500 --> 00:40:49,349
again you know I've never figured out

930
00:40:56,660 --> 00:40:50,510
why

931
00:41:00,740 --> 00:40:56,670
care he didn't like he didn't like the

932
00:41:02,030 --> 00:41:00,750
CGI helmet color or the shape of the jet

933
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:02,040
wasn't cool enough he called it a

934
00:41:06,620 --> 00:41:04,050
cartoon so maybe he doesn't like CGI

935
00:41:08,930 --> 00:41:06,630
soccer well well well and well add the

936
00:41:11,180 --> 00:41:08,940
the unfortunate part of all that is that

937
00:41:13,670 --> 00:41:11,190
the CGI work that you did for this film

938
00:41:17,690 --> 00:41:13,680
was a superior to the CGI work that was

939
00:41:19,790 --> 00:41:17,700
done in the in the unidentified program

940
00:41:22,010 --> 00:41:19,800
so you got that going for you David did

941
00:41:24,890 --> 00:41:22,020
a nice job on that so I have two

942
00:41:27,470 --> 00:41:24,900
questions one for Dave and then one for

943
00:41:31,070 --> 00:41:27,480
a Christian I wanted to mention by the

944
00:41:34,460 --> 00:41:31,080
way we did have Paco cirucci on our show

945
00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:34,470
on twelve seventeen a 2019 anyway Dave

946
00:41:38,420 --> 00:41:35,970
you mentioned that it was sort of a

947
00:41:40,940 --> 00:41:38,430
mixed blessing you actually had the

948
00:41:42,560 --> 00:41:40,950
opportunity add more material to your us

949
00:41:44,870 --> 00:41:42,570
estimates encounter award-winning

950
00:41:47,450 --> 00:41:44,880
documentary what I wanted to know from

951
00:41:51,710 --> 00:41:47,460
you is where can folks actually see that

952
00:41:53,750 --> 00:41:51,720
so that they can directly access it and

953
00:41:56,470 --> 00:41:53,760
watch it and then have a question a

954
00:41:59,600 --> 00:41:56,480
question for Christian right after that

955
00:42:02,210 --> 00:41:59,610
yeah thanks I mean you can watch the

956
00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:02,220
film either from my website at Nimitz

957
00:42:07,250 --> 00:42:05,010
Encounters calm it's on YouTube and you

958
00:42:09,140 --> 00:42:07,260
can also find it on Amazon Prime if you

959
00:42:14,750 --> 00:42:09,150
want to see it on your widescreen you

960
00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:14,760
know home theater system okay wonderful

961
00:42:19,790 --> 00:42:16,770
thank you very much and the question you

962
00:42:21,860 --> 00:42:19,800
have for Christian is and also for Dave

963
00:42:25,220 --> 00:42:21,870
but I wanted to know Christian do you

964
00:42:28,070 --> 00:42:25,230
think and that if anybody had the

965
00:42:32,150 --> 00:42:28,080
wherewithal to continue aggressively

966
00:42:35,060 --> 00:42:32,160
doing FOIA requests of the US Navy or

967
00:42:37,370 --> 00:42:35,070
any other faction of the US government

968
00:42:40,160 --> 00:42:37,380
or maybe even another country's

969
00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:40,170
government on the tick-tack topic they

970
00:42:49,850 --> 00:42:42,570
would come up with anything at all is it

971
00:42:52,190 --> 00:42:49,860
even worth trying I don't know whether I

972
00:42:56,000 --> 00:42:52,200
think it's would be ultimately a waste

973
00:43:00,710 --> 00:42:56,010
of time because either they they can

974
00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:00,720
stall for any number of reasons I'm sure

975
00:43:03,900 --> 00:43:02,970
Dave probably has seen it but as if

976
00:43:07,200 --> 00:43:03,910
anyone has seen

977
00:43:09,750 --> 00:43:07,210
recent article by Tyler Rogo way on the

978
00:43:12,240 --> 00:43:09,760
problems he's had trying to get answers

979
00:43:16,140 --> 00:43:12,250
to information of course he's had to OSD

980
00:43:18,270 --> 00:43:16,150
and tell him the tone of his writing

981
00:43:21,180 --> 00:43:18,280
that he is frustrated on the verge of

982
00:43:26,660 --> 00:43:21,190
anger for what he sees as blatant

983
00:43:29,220 --> 00:43:26,670
disregard practically at the same time

984
00:43:31,049 --> 00:43:29,230
the other side the government site

985
00:43:34,529 --> 00:43:31,059
wherever we'd be sending our requests

986
00:43:36,710 --> 00:43:34,539
essentially holds all the cards they if

987
00:43:40,559 --> 00:43:36,720
it's something they can find a way to

988
00:43:42,420 --> 00:43:40,569
withhold why wouldn't they I mean I can

989
00:43:44,309 --> 00:43:42,430
understand when you go to the premise

990
00:43:46,309 --> 00:43:44,319
that well information that gets to the

991
00:43:48,690 --> 00:43:46,319
public may very well be getting to our

992
00:43:50,370 --> 00:43:48,700
enemies whoever they might be

993
00:43:53,160 --> 00:43:50,380
so they'll wonder with whole thing's

994
00:43:56,160 --> 00:43:53,170
just for that reason but as far as

995
00:43:58,529 --> 00:43:56,170
something like this when if you look

996
00:44:02,010 --> 00:43:58,539
back on it we're really in the same

997
00:44:04,950 --> 00:44:02,020
position we were in even back when the

998
00:44:08,220 --> 00:44:04,960
FOI a capability first came about 50

999
00:44:09,690 --> 00:44:08,230
years on same situation hurry up and

1000
00:44:12,289 --> 00:44:09,700
wait you don't get answers you get

1001
00:44:15,599 --> 00:44:12,299
answers on some things but effectively I

1002
00:44:20,279 --> 00:44:15,609
don't know that you would ever get a

1003
00:44:22,410 --> 00:44:20,289
direct here it is expose everything if

1004
00:44:26,069 --> 00:44:22,420
the whole purpose is to not expose

1005
00:44:27,890 --> 00:44:26,079
anything so my the best luck I've had

1006
00:44:30,990 --> 00:44:27,900
and I'll call it luck I guess

1007
00:44:33,450 --> 00:44:31,000
on occasion has been you get something

1008
00:44:35,730 --> 00:44:33,460
in a response that you can then add to

1009
00:44:37,980 --> 00:44:35,740
something else and formulate a better

1010
00:44:39,630 --> 00:44:37,990
question that maybe gets you a little

1011
00:44:42,510 --> 00:44:39,640
bit further down the road but it's

1012
00:44:44,370 --> 00:44:42,520
almost like what's my line can you ask

1013
00:44:46,339 --> 00:44:44,380
questions and you try to deduce what to

1014
00:44:50,309 --> 00:44:46,349
ask next and you kind of build on that

1015
00:44:56,120 --> 00:44:50,319
if I had to because I thought about this

1016
00:44:59,339 --> 00:44:56,130
in the last days and weeks the only way

1017
00:45:02,190 --> 00:44:59,349
the UFO community and I use that term

1018
00:45:04,740 --> 00:45:02,200
broadly but those of us who are serious

1019
00:45:06,839 --> 00:45:04,750
about wanting to know what's really

1020
00:45:09,269 --> 00:45:06,849
going on or ever going in my opinion

1021
00:45:12,660 --> 00:45:09,279
ever going to accomplish anything is to

1022
00:45:15,660 --> 00:45:12,670
organize we need some organization or

1023
00:45:18,840 --> 00:45:15,670
some type of legitimate organization

1024
00:45:22,710 --> 00:45:18,850
that's transparent that can generate

1025
00:45:25,260 --> 00:45:22,720
some kind of voting block I don't know

1026
00:45:27,930 --> 00:45:25,270
that I'm anywhere near the person to do

1027
00:45:29,880 --> 00:45:27,940
that I'm much more of a frontline boots

1028
00:45:31,440 --> 00:45:29,890
out there in the field type but

1029
00:45:33,180 --> 00:45:31,450
realistically I mean it's like trying to

1030
00:45:35,220 --> 00:45:33,190
call your Congressman as an individual

1031
00:45:38,840 --> 00:45:35,230
thank you bye-bye

1032
00:45:42,630 --> 00:45:38,850
you know that's it you need some type of

1033
00:45:46,530 --> 00:45:42,640
organized effort that the public can get

1034
00:45:48,570 --> 00:45:46,540
behind where they don't sense deception

1035
00:45:53,070 --> 00:45:48,580
or that you're not being told certain

1036
00:45:55,410 --> 00:45:53,080
things but as far as FY goes it's the

1037
00:45:56,910 --> 00:45:55,420
only that's the only game in town as far

1038
00:46:00,120 --> 00:45:56,920
as approaching the government for

1039
00:46:02,010 --> 00:46:00,130
information and so I'm not telling

1040
00:46:03,270 --> 00:46:02,020
anybody to stop doing it and it depends

1041
00:46:04,560 --> 00:46:03,280
to a great extent on what you're asking

1042
00:46:08,970 --> 00:46:04,570
I mean the types of things we're asking

1043
00:46:11,550 --> 00:46:08,980
or some pretty touchy areas that involve

1044
00:46:12,930 --> 00:46:11,560
a lot of legitimate secret things if

1045
00:46:14,490 --> 00:46:12,940
it's history if you're looking you know

1046
00:46:15,870 --> 00:46:14,500
I have plenty of people that I'm glad

1047
00:46:17,790 --> 00:46:15,880
they're following a FOIA request for

1048
00:46:20,490 --> 00:46:17,800
information that we get out in the long

1049
00:46:22,590 --> 00:46:20,500
run but something that's pertinent right

1050
00:46:25,710 --> 00:46:22,600
now like this kind of a subject I don't

1051
00:46:27,630 --> 00:46:25,720
know I still do it myself but you know

1052
00:46:29,160 --> 00:46:27,640
you send it out there on a wing and a

1053
00:46:30,570 --> 00:46:29,170
prayer and then hope you've worded it

1054
00:46:32,910 --> 00:46:30,580
correctly

1055
00:46:34,920 --> 00:46:32,920
I'll even mention an example of

1056
00:46:38,850 --> 00:46:34,930
something just the other day it

1057
00:46:39,720 --> 00:46:38,860
indirectly relates to to the Stars so I

1058
00:46:41,940 --> 00:46:39,730
don't want to get off on the subject

1059
00:46:45,330 --> 00:46:41,950
that way but it comes from a misreading

1060
00:46:47,370 --> 00:46:45,340
of the spelling and I mentioned it to

1061
00:46:50,880 --> 00:46:47,380
you last time I think that the the army

1062
00:46:54,930 --> 00:46:50,890
crater that has the OSD in there as a as

1063
00:46:56,130 --> 00:46:54,940
a participant I was looking at the

1064
00:46:58,020 --> 00:46:56,140
wording because I was going to make sure

1065
00:47:02,330 --> 00:46:58,030
that it was office of Secretary of

1066
00:47:05,250 --> 00:47:02,340
Defense but they don't stipulate

1067
00:47:10,980 --> 00:47:05,260
material I suddenly looked at it closely

1068
00:47:13,680 --> 00:47:10,990
and it says material there is a subtle

1069
00:47:17,130 --> 00:47:13,690
but very specific difference between

1070
00:47:19,560 --> 00:47:17,140
those two words yeah instead of a yes

1071
00:47:21,500 --> 00:47:19,570
exactly no material is far more common

1072
00:47:23,820 --> 00:47:21,510
in the military so perhaps that's just

1073
00:47:25,140 --> 00:47:23,830
terminology that's used when they aren't

1074
00:47:26,730 --> 00:47:25,150
you know by whoever writes the crater

1075
00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:26,740
with the army and so it tends they tend

1076
00:47:30,930 --> 00:47:28,450
to use material

1077
00:47:32,790 --> 00:47:30,940
but of course my request for information

1078
00:47:34,770 --> 00:47:32,800
although I didn't specifically state

1079
00:47:38,460 --> 00:47:34,780
material but I have to go back and even

1080
00:47:41,190 --> 00:47:38,470
read that now so it may be vital to be

1081
00:47:46,440 --> 00:47:41,200
sure that if I've requested material

1082
00:47:49,579 --> 00:47:46,450
with an a but when they indicate that

1083
00:47:55,710 --> 00:47:49,589
the OSD can share information on the

1084
00:47:57,270 --> 00:47:55,720
material that may in that context when

1085
00:47:59,730 --> 00:47:57,280
you're writing to the army or someone in

1086
00:48:01,680 --> 00:47:59,740
the military that might be able to be

1087
00:48:03,540 --> 00:48:01,690
interpreted in a slightly different way

1088
00:48:06,300 --> 00:48:03,550
or I didn't spell out exactly what it

1089
00:48:08,430 --> 00:48:06,310
says so they can they don't have to tell

1090
00:48:11,310 --> 00:48:08,440
me I spelled it wrongly or that I read

1091
00:48:13,620 --> 00:48:11,320
it missed I misread it so once again

1092
00:48:16,349 --> 00:48:13,630
it's a thought do I do that or do I wait

1093
00:48:18,410 --> 00:48:16,359
or do I so my point is it's important in

1094
00:48:20,880 --> 00:48:18,420
FY these to be sure that you're

1095
00:48:23,069 --> 00:48:20,890
requesting the right thing because I

1096
00:48:25,859 --> 00:48:23,079
think unfortunately we can make human

1097
00:48:27,510 --> 00:48:25,869
mistakes and unfortunately they can also

1098
00:48:29,609 --> 00:48:27,520
tell you know we don't have anything

1099
00:48:32,310 --> 00:48:29,619
because you asked the wrong question or

1100
00:48:33,990 --> 00:48:32,320
you ask the wrong wording so anyway that

1101
00:48:36,089 --> 00:48:34,000
was I'd mean to get off the subject well

1102
00:48:39,180 --> 00:48:36,099
dave has to go here pretty soon but I

1103
00:48:40,530 --> 00:48:39,190
wanted to ask Dave the same question do

1104
00:48:43,740 --> 00:48:40,540
you think that it's a fruitless endeavor

1105
00:48:46,050 --> 00:48:43,750
to go ahead and continue to insist on

1106
00:48:48,690 --> 00:48:46,060
knowing more about the tic-tock topic

1107
00:48:52,020 --> 00:48:48,700
from any government around the world by

1108
00:48:56,640 --> 00:48:52,030
filling out voya requests that seemed at

1109
00:48:59,309 --> 00:48:56,650
times needlessly disregarded that are

1110
00:49:03,150 --> 00:48:59,319
suspected so by some researchers on this

1111
00:49:04,800 --> 00:49:03,160
topic well you know I think that it's a

1112
00:49:07,500 --> 00:49:04,810
really great resource that we have

1113
00:49:10,470 --> 00:49:07,510
available and we should use it I mean

1114
00:49:13,050 --> 00:49:10,480
not all countries have that open

1115
00:49:16,109 --> 00:49:13,060
government policy and it's available to

1116
00:49:18,630 --> 00:49:16,119
every citizen so I don't feel guilty at

1117
00:49:20,099 --> 00:49:18,640
all firing at a whole bunch of foyers

1118
00:49:23,910 --> 00:49:20,109
that probably take a lot of work because

1119
00:49:27,500 --> 00:49:23,920
again that's what the law says we can do

1120
00:49:30,569 --> 00:49:27,510
and I've actually found a lot of

1121
00:49:32,849 --> 00:49:30,579
interesting things and just like

1122
00:49:42,120 --> 00:49:32,859
Christian said it's almost like you have

1123
00:49:47,260 --> 00:49:45,849
and thinking trying to seek that may

1124
00:49:50,950 --> 00:49:47,270
give you some information but not

1125
00:49:52,599 --> 00:49:50,960
directly where it may get denied one of

1126
00:49:54,880 --> 00:49:52,609
the things that helped me for instance

1127
00:49:58,480 --> 00:49:54,890
was to begin looking at the Carrier

1128
00:50:01,630 --> 00:49:58,490
Strike groups as in you know sort of a

1129
00:50:03,339 --> 00:50:01,640
group of ships and not all the ships we

1130
00:50:05,859 --> 00:50:03,349
know about so what are the other ships

1131
00:50:09,190 --> 00:50:05,869
that might have been there maybe they

1132
00:50:13,089 --> 00:50:09,200
know something and I was successful in

1133
00:50:17,800 --> 00:50:13,099
in the case of the nimitz encounters and

1134
00:50:20,109 --> 00:50:17,810
getting soyuz for the other cruisers

1135
00:50:21,609 --> 00:50:20,119
that were out there actually the

1136
00:50:22,780 --> 00:50:21,619
destroyers that were out there with the

1137
00:50:25,390 --> 00:50:22,790
crews of the princeton there were sort

1138
00:50:27,040 --> 00:50:25,400
of the sister ships unfortunately i

1139
00:50:31,680 --> 00:50:27,050
found out later that they were not on

1140
00:50:34,650 --> 00:50:31,690
the scene and when we tried to get the

1141
00:50:38,290 --> 00:50:34,660
princeton itself we found out that that

1142
00:50:40,750 --> 00:50:38,300
logs for that ship were missing and you

1143
00:50:43,420 --> 00:50:40,760
just kind of hop scotch to the next

1144
00:50:45,599 --> 00:50:43,430
subject and the next thing every every

1145
00:50:47,859 --> 00:50:45,609
little nook and cranny you can find

1146
00:50:50,200 --> 00:50:47,869
unfortunately in the case of the Nimitz

1147
00:50:52,270 --> 00:50:50,210
over and over I was told that these

1148
00:50:54,910 --> 00:50:52,280
records were destroyed in that the Navy

1149
00:50:56,890 --> 00:50:54,920
doesn't have to keep like 90% of the

1150
00:50:58,120 --> 00:50:56,900
records after two years they just can

1151
00:50:59,349 --> 00:50:58,130
say that they're destroyed everything

1152
00:51:02,440 --> 00:50:59,359
have to look for them even if they do

1153
00:51:03,790 --> 00:51:02,450
exist so I have I still have a bunch out

1154
00:51:05,859 --> 00:51:03,800
there and I don't give up even though I

1155
00:51:08,140 --> 00:51:05,869
know it's more than two years I have a

1156
00:51:09,880 --> 00:51:08,150
bunch of boys out there for documents

1157
00:51:11,380 --> 00:51:09,890
that have been mentioned itself yeah we

1158
00:51:13,780 --> 00:51:11,390
had a great show yesterday with Paul

1159
00:51:17,339 --> 00:51:13,790
Dean who's a good friend of both of

1160
00:51:20,620 --> 00:51:17,349
yours and he was talking about how

1161
00:51:25,450 --> 00:51:20,630
frustrating it can be to have a circular

1162
00:51:28,480 --> 00:51:25,460
conversation with federal or other kinds

1163
00:51:33,010 --> 00:51:28,490
of agencies from the US government just

1164
00:51:37,120 --> 00:51:33,020
seemingly being apathetic to FOIA

1165
00:51:39,190 --> 00:51:37,130
requests or not responding there they're

1166
00:51:41,410 --> 00:51:39,200
responding in manners if they have no

1167
00:51:43,900 --> 00:51:41,420
idea what you're talking about

1168
00:51:45,099 --> 00:51:43,910
or it's going to the wrong Department or

1169
00:51:47,980 --> 00:51:45,109
whatever you know these kinds of

1170
00:51:50,770 --> 00:51:47,990
ridiculous things that can occur and I

1171
00:51:54,000 --> 00:51:50,780
asked him what what could what advice

1172
00:51:55,600 --> 00:51:54,010
can you give to a person who's new at

1173
00:52:06,700 --> 00:51:55,610
filling out FOIA

1174
00:52:08,350 --> 00:52:06,710
request and he said patience yeah

1175
00:52:10,090 --> 00:52:08,360
sometimes it takes a week I mean a

1176
00:52:12,190 --> 00:52:10,100
couple weeks and you get and then other

1177
00:52:14,710 --> 00:52:12,200
times you're like wait a second it's

1178
00:52:17,080 --> 00:52:14,720
been two years yeah and we actually

1179
00:52:19,840 --> 00:52:17,090
talked about that the last hour you with

1180
00:52:22,930 --> 00:52:19,850
Kristian Lambright also about something

1181
00:52:26,110 --> 00:52:22,940
very interesting it's not funny to some

1182
00:52:28,090 --> 00:52:26,120
people but but it is to others and in a

1183
00:52:30,160 --> 00:52:28,100
bitter way and dad is on the national

1184
00:52:32,170 --> 00:52:30,170
security archives website they have an

1185
00:52:36,250 --> 00:52:32,180
interesting article titled something

1186
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:36,260
like 25 year old FOIA requests basically

1187
00:52:42,010 --> 00:52:40,010
delayed and there's many federal

1188
00:52:47,230 --> 00:52:42,020
agencies involved regard regarding these

1189
00:52:49,570 --> 00:52:47,240
kinds of 25 year old request FOIA

1190
00:52:51,610 --> 00:52:49,580
related requests and there's just people

1191
00:52:54,130 --> 00:52:51,620
waiting and it's interesting because

1192
00:52:57,580 --> 00:52:54,140
what if you wait two and a half decades

1193
00:52:59,740 --> 00:52:57,590
for a couple FOIA as you put in and did

1194
00:53:01,120 --> 00:52:59,750
then just get denied you know you get a

1195
00:53:06,040 --> 00:53:01,130
letter in the mail saying that you're

1196
00:53:07,690 --> 00:53:06,050
denied on them how frustrating is that I

1197
00:53:09,610 --> 00:53:07,700
wanted to go ahead and mention to our

1198
00:53:12,310 --> 00:53:09,620
listeners just something interesting

1199
00:53:17,500 --> 00:53:12,320
before dave has to go and that is that

1200
00:53:19,840 --> 00:53:17,510
the FOIA request the ability and the

1201
00:53:22,360 --> 00:53:19,850
privilege to do that was signed into law

1202
00:53:25,780 --> 00:53:22,370
in 1966 by president lyndon b johnson

1203
00:53:28,750 --> 00:53:25,790
and I know that Christian and Paul Dean

1204
00:53:31,090 --> 00:53:28,760
would probably agree with me on this but

1205
00:53:33,910 --> 00:53:31,100
the government really needs to work

1206
00:53:36,640 --> 00:53:33,920
better on a better system for the folks

1207
00:53:39,430 --> 00:53:36,650
who are filling out a request but I

1208
00:53:43,450 --> 00:53:39,440
think that the many many factions of the

1209
00:53:46,090 --> 00:53:43,460
government enjoy the fact is that FOIA

1210
00:53:49,060 --> 00:53:46,100
requesters are given a hard time at

1211
00:53:51,310 --> 00:53:49,070
times and that it is seemingly

1212
00:53:53,470 --> 00:53:51,320
impossible at times to be able to get

1213
00:53:56,620 --> 00:53:53,480
information through FOIA requests what

1214
00:53:58,660 --> 00:53:56,630
are your thoughts on that I don't if you

1215
00:54:00,580 --> 00:53:58,670
recall a recent one that John Greenwald

1216
00:54:02,950 --> 00:54:00,590
had pointed out that apparently one of

1217
00:54:05,470 --> 00:54:02,960
the items he got was a response from one

1218
00:54:07,570 --> 00:54:05,480
of the departments something showing a

1219
00:54:08,839 --> 00:54:07,580
yay we beat John Green wall on some

1220
00:54:10,759 --> 00:54:08,849
requests he was putting out

1221
00:54:12,620 --> 00:54:10,769
and you think why would they have that

1222
00:54:16,190 --> 00:54:12,630
attitude you know why wouldn't they

1223
00:54:17,749 --> 00:54:16,200
realize that well I don't know you know

1224
00:54:19,219 --> 00:54:17,759
sometimes you think I've heard the story

1225
00:54:21,769 --> 00:54:19,229
that if you're a police officer

1226
00:54:24,170 --> 00:54:21,779
eventually everybody that's not a

1227
00:54:26,719 --> 00:54:24,180
policeman becomes potentially a suspect

1228
00:54:28,099 --> 00:54:26,729
or somebody who's maybe if you've been

1229
00:54:30,979 --> 00:54:28,109
in the government or in there in the FO

1230
00:54:34,670 --> 00:54:30,989
a department or something eventually you

1231
00:54:35,960 --> 00:54:34,680
are so accustomed to now and especially

1232
00:54:37,339 --> 00:54:35,970
if you're someplace where people are

1233
00:54:39,769 --> 00:54:37,349
hitting you up for information that

1234
00:54:41,210 --> 00:54:39,779
we're asking for where you know you're

1235
00:54:42,890 --> 00:54:41,220
dancing this fine line between

1236
00:54:44,539 --> 00:54:42,900
classified information and for all I

1237
00:54:46,940 --> 00:54:44,549
know you've got your bosses up above

1238
00:54:48,710 --> 00:54:46,950
telling you to make it work and you're

1239
00:54:50,479 --> 00:54:48,720
gonna take the hit you know the people

1240
00:54:52,160 --> 00:54:50,489
have to respond or no you're gonna write

1241
00:54:54,950 --> 00:54:52,170
back and pick at them about something

1242
00:54:58,279 --> 00:54:54,960
they said but yeah I don't know it's

1243
00:55:00,380 --> 00:54:58,289
frustrating to me it's just I I don't

1244
00:55:01,910 --> 00:55:00,390
yeah I agree with Dave I mean it's what

1245
00:55:04,819 --> 00:55:01,920
we have and it's a fortunate thing that

1246
00:55:09,289 --> 00:55:04,829
we have it and we've made some progress

1247
00:55:12,019 --> 00:55:09,299
but I agree I wanted to mention just a

1248
00:55:14,420 --> 00:55:12,029
few agencies that are the top fed aged

1249
00:55:16,160 --> 00:55:14,430
agencies receiving the most foia

1250
00:55:17,779 --> 00:55:16,170
requests and then just go ahead and and

1251
00:55:30,600 --> 00:55:17,789
tell Dave thank you for having been on

1252
00:55:37,740 --> 00:55:34,950
see he is receiving the most by veteran

1253
00:55:40,050 --> 00:55:37,750
affairs US Department of Agriculture us

1254
00:55:42,060 --> 00:55:40,060
equal equal and unemployment Opportunity

1255
00:55:43,740 --> 00:55:42,070
Commission the National Archives and

1256
00:55:46,710 --> 00:55:43,750
Records Administration and the US

1257
00:55:48,300 --> 00:55:46,720
Department of Labor Dave I wanted to

1258
00:55:51,210 --> 00:55:48,310
thank you for having been on our show

1259
00:55:53,790 --> 00:55:51,220
today it was a real eye-opener regarding

1260
00:55:55,320 --> 00:55:53,800
the interesting information you had to

1261
00:55:57,360 --> 00:55:55,330
update all of us on on the tick-tack

1262
00:56:02,120 --> 00:55:57,370
topic and we look forward to having you

1263
00:56:05,280 --> 00:56:02,130
on more of our shows this year yeah

1264
00:56:07,710 --> 00:56:05,290
other little story it's interesting yes

1265
00:56:10,110 --> 00:56:07,720
please do you know when I first started

1266
00:56:11,880 --> 00:56:10,120
doing the FOIA is I didn't know much and

1267
00:56:16,640 --> 00:56:11,890
the first ones I was doing we're all

1268
00:56:19,220 --> 00:56:16,650
going through the Navy history command

1269
00:56:22,860 --> 00:56:19,230
which is part of the archives that

1270
00:56:25,440 --> 00:56:22,870
exists through the Navy and you know

1271
00:56:28,230 --> 00:56:25,450
they're their archives go back you know

1272
00:56:32,760 --> 00:56:28,240
decades and decades and decades and I

1273
00:56:34,440 --> 00:56:32,770
found it was a FOIA liaison officer that

1274
00:56:36,960 --> 00:56:34,450
worked out of that office that was

1275
00:56:40,230 --> 00:56:36,970
really really helpful to me and that

1276
00:56:42,780 --> 00:56:40,240
took the time to kind of walk me through

1277
00:56:44,610 --> 00:56:42,790
it if I if I was trying to find out you

1278
00:56:49,140 --> 00:56:44,620
know where do I find these records who

1279
00:56:52,260 --> 00:56:49,150
do I ask this person actually went out

1280
00:56:54,900 --> 00:56:52,270
of their way to help me out and you know

1281
00:56:56,790 --> 00:56:54,910
so I do you know take my hats off to

1282
00:56:58,170 --> 00:56:56,800
some of these government employees and

1283
00:57:01,680 --> 00:56:58,180
civilian employees that work in those

1284
00:57:04,710 --> 00:57:01,690
offices I mean I took the time to you

1285
00:57:06,540 --> 00:57:04,720
know write her command and let them know

1286
00:57:08,910 --> 00:57:06,550
what a great employee they had in this

1287
00:57:11,610 --> 00:57:08,920
woman and you know kind of gave her

1288
00:57:13,350 --> 00:57:11,620
praise and later on she said that you

1289
00:57:15,330 --> 00:57:13,360
know at the end of the year before the

1290
00:57:17,160 --> 00:57:15,340
break when they had their meeting they

1291
00:57:19,200 --> 00:57:17,170
brought her up to the front of the of

1292
00:57:21,270 --> 00:57:19,210
the room in front of everybody and sort

1293
00:57:22,920 --> 00:57:21,280
of you know gave her accolades because I

1294
00:57:25,470 --> 00:57:22,930
wrote that letter and kind of read it in

1295
00:57:27,420 --> 00:57:25,480
front of everybody so you know I mean

1296
00:57:29,700 --> 00:57:27,430
sometimes I think that you know there

1297
00:57:31,980 --> 00:57:29,710
are unsung heroes these people in these

1298
00:57:34,800 --> 00:57:31,990
positions and I really appreciated that

1299
00:57:36,870 --> 00:57:34,810
and you know later on when I needed

1300
00:57:39,480 --> 00:57:36,880
something for instance I was trying to

1301
00:57:41,580 --> 00:57:39,490
find out if anyone had ever fallen

1302
00:57:43,970 --> 00:57:41,590
overboard on the USS Nimitz during

1303
00:57:46,430 --> 00:57:43,980
November 2004 there was a man over

1304
00:57:48,440 --> 00:57:46,440
or during that entire time and I would

1305
00:57:51,710 --> 00:57:48,450
have been able to get those records she

1306
00:57:56,359 --> 00:57:51,720
buy on her own went through the records

1307
00:57:59,330 --> 00:57:56,369
over 400 pages of Nimitz logs to see if

1308
00:58:02,180 --> 00:57:59,340
she could find any Man Overboard during

1309
00:58:04,460 --> 00:58:02,190
that entire time which later on she said

1310
00:58:07,640 --> 00:58:04,470
that there was there were no records of

1311
00:58:10,070 --> 00:58:07,650
a man falling off the USS Nimitz but she

1312
00:58:11,840 --> 00:58:10,080
did that on her own like you know which

1313
00:58:14,030 --> 00:58:11,850
I mean I don't know if it was because I

1314
00:58:16,609 --> 00:58:14,040
wrote that letter but it certainly

1315
00:58:18,980 --> 00:58:16,619
helped so there's my little tips for

1316
00:58:21,349 --> 00:58:18,990
your researchers yeah we do want to give

1317
00:58:23,480 --> 00:58:21,359
them accolades and we also want to give

1318
00:58:25,790 --> 00:58:23,490
a great big thank you to people who work

1319
00:58:27,680 --> 00:58:25,800
for governments around the world that

1320
00:58:29,270 --> 00:58:27,690
have no idea what they're doing and they

1321
00:58:37,250 --> 00:58:29,280
accidentally give too much information

1322
00:58:38,599 --> 00:58:37,260
by machine to all those people and thank

1323
00:58:41,260 --> 00:58:38,609
you Dave for having been on our show can

1324
00:58:46,609 --> 00:58:41,270
you please remind our listeners the

1325
00:58:49,550 --> 00:58:46,619
website or the area of YouTube or the

1326
00:58:51,349 --> 00:58:49,560
forum that you have your wonderful USS

1327
00:58:54,200 --> 00:58:51,359
Nimitz Encounters documentary that you

1328
00:58:56,690 --> 00:58:54,210
have updated yeah absolutely

1329
00:58:59,300 --> 00:58:56,700
you can go to the Nimitz Encounters calm

1330
00:59:01,010 --> 00:58:59,310
I have the film on there plus a bunch of

1331
00:59:03,230 --> 00:59:01,020
other interesting documents and so on

1332
00:59:05,270 --> 00:59:03,240
that are related to that if you just go

1333
00:59:08,570 --> 00:59:05,280
to youtube and search the Nimitz

1334
00:59:11,060 --> 00:59:08,580
Encounters or on Amazon Prime video you

1335
00:59:12,410 --> 00:59:11,070
can go and again just search for the

1336
00:59:15,140 --> 00:59:12,420
Nimitz Encounters and you'll probably

1337
00:59:17,420 --> 00:59:15,150
see that that old feature film from the

1338
00:59:18,800 --> 00:59:17,430
70s but you'll also see my film on there

1339
00:59:22,130 --> 00:59:18,810
as well if you'd like to watch it and

1340
00:59:24,109 --> 00:59:22,140
would it be correct that if folks went

1341
00:59:26,450 --> 00:59:24,119
to your channel on YouTube they would

1342
00:59:29,690 --> 00:59:26,460
see it yeah I'm the channel you'll see

1343
00:59:32,420 --> 00:59:29,700
the various different versions of the

1344
00:59:35,120 --> 00:59:32,430
film unless I've kind of posted all of

1345
00:59:37,550 --> 00:59:35,130
the witnesses that have done interviews

1346
00:59:38,930 --> 00:59:37,560
with me I think we're up to five or six

1347
00:59:41,240 --> 00:59:38,940
now that are on there just in their

1348
00:59:43,550 --> 00:59:41,250
entirety I wanted to give a kind of a

1349
00:59:44,870 --> 00:59:43,560
disclaimer to our listeners folks just

1350
00:59:46,430 --> 00:59:44,880
do yourself a favor and go to his

1351
00:59:48,440 --> 00:59:46,440
channel we'll mention which one it is in

1352
00:59:50,300 --> 00:59:48,450
a second it's much better to go today

1353
00:59:52,310 --> 00:59:50,310
Beatty's Channel reason why is because

1354
00:59:55,760 --> 00:59:52,320
of what he just said there's going to be

1355
00:59:57,650 --> 00:59:55,770
a lot more information packed on that

1356
00:59:59,900 --> 00:59:57,660
tic-tac topic

1357
01:00:02,900 --> 00:59:59,910
and that will educate you on the latest

1358
01:00:04,430 --> 01:00:02,910
stuff and updates so Dave do you mind

1359
01:00:07,069 --> 01:00:04,440
just giving out the name of your YouTube

1360
01:00:09,380 --> 01:00:07,079
channel that way people know they can

1361
01:00:11,420 --> 01:00:09,390
google it and find it right away yeah my

1362
01:00:14,029 --> 01:00:11,430
youtube channel is the Nimbus Encounters

1363
01:00:16,579 --> 01:00:14,039
and go ahead and subscribe so if you--if

1364
01:00:19,309 --> 01:00:16,589
I do post a new video and again I don't

1365
01:00:21,770 --> 01:00:19,319
spam out and I very rarely post a video

1366
01:00:23,690 --> 01:00:21,780
but if you go there and you subscribe

1367
01:00:25,039 --> 01:00:23,700
that way if I do have any witness or a

1368
01:00:27,890 --> 01:00:25,049
new film that comes out you'll get

1369
01:00:29,329 --> 01:00:27,900
notified fantastic thank you so much we

1370
01:00:31,039 --> 01:00:29,339
hope that you stay safe and have a

1371
01:00:33,319 --> 01:00:31,049
lovely rest of your weekend with your

1372
01:00:33,740 --> 01:00:33,329
family thanks a lot Dave yeah thanks

1373
01:00:37,099 --> 01:00:33,750
Dave

1374
01:00:38,539 --> 01:00:37,109
okay I wanted to go ahead and touch on

1375
01:00:41,630 --> 01:00:38,549
an interesting topic that we're going to

1376
01:00:43,730 --> 01:00:41,640
bring up with an expert on this topic a

1377
01:00:45,529 --> 01:00:43,740
few of them actually it's a Christian

1378
01:00:47,359 --> 01:00:45,539
lamb right is still with us because

1379
01:00:49,160 --> 01:00:47,369
we're going to cover a really

1380
01:00:52,190 --> 01:00:49,170
fascinating incident called the cash

1381
01:00:54,230 --> 01:00:52,200
Landrum incident and by the way Frank if

1382
01:00:57,020 --> 01:00:54,240
you wouldn't mind try bringing in a Jan

1383
01:00:58,490 --> 01:00:57,030
Aldrich is on standby we're gonna try

1384
01:01:01,460 --> 01:00:58,500
reaching him you might hear his voice

1385
01:01:03,440 --> 01:01:01,470
mail but if that's the case we might try

1386
01:01:05,809 --> 01:01:03,450
him again to have him join us on this

1387
01:01:08,329 --> 01:01:05,819
topic Christian I wanted to ask you

1388
01:01:10,849 --> 01:01:08,339
about the cash Landrum incident but

1389
01:01:17,870 --> 01:01:10,859
before I do that I wanted to actually

1390
01:01:19,130 --> 01:01:17,880
share with our listeners an I wanted to

1391
01:01:20,990 --> 01:01:19,140
share with our listeners a little bit

1392
01:01:23,890 --> 01:01:21,000
regarding history of the cash Landrum

1393
01:01:26,599 --> 01:01:23,900
incident and that was an alleged UFO

1394
01:01:28,910 --> 01:01:26,609
sighting from the United States in 1980

1395
01:01:30,859 --> 01:01:28,920
which witnesses claimed was responsible

1396
01:01:34,370 --> 01:01:30,869
for causing health and property damage

1397
01:01:37,430 --> 01:01:34,380
that was an uncharacteristic for such a

1398
01:01:39,950 --> 01:01:37,440
UFO reports and this resulted in civil

1399
01:01:42,019 --> 01:01:39,960
court proceedings and the case ended in

1400
01:01:43,700 --> 01:01:42,029
a dismissal wanted to start with

1401
01:01:46,220 --> 01:01:43,710
Christian on this topic

1402
01:01:49,160 --> 01:01:46,230
can you please kind of gloss over and

1403
01:01:54,200 --> 01:01:49,170
give a general definitive history on the

1404
01:01:57,440 --> 01:01:54,210
cash Landrum incident sure sure

1405
01:01:59,960 --> 01:01:57,450
I believe it was the 28th 29th of

1406
01:02:02,269 --> 01:01:59,970
December 1980 so one of those two days I

1407
01:02:06,440 --> 01:02:02,279
don't recall exactly but the very end of

1408
01:02:09,020 --> 01:02:06,450
the year and two women and a little boy

1409
01:02:11,270 --> 01:02:09,030
this was Betty cash

1410
01:02:15,590 --> 01:02:11,280
Vickie Landrum and Vickie Landrum's

1411
01:02:17,620 --> 01:02:15,600
grandson Colby I believe it was at the

1412
01:02:20,270 --> 01:02:17,630
time of year they were going to look for

1413
01:02:21,500 --> 01:02:20,280
some kind of a bingo game something that

1414
01:02:25,070 --> 01:02:21,510
had been happening and this isn't an

1415
01:02:28,250 --> 01:02:25,080
area that's actually just east of

1416
01:02:29,900 --> 01:02:28,260
Houston and slightly north there's a

1417
01:02:33,020 --> 01:02:29,910
lake there and it's between Houston and

1418
01:02:36,680 --> 01:02:33,030
Dayton in the area of Huffman New Caney

1419
01:02:38,030 --> 01:02:36,690
kind of Huffman New Caney Road and they

1420
01:02:39,410 --> 01:02:38,040
had been looking for I think it was a

1421
01:02:41,990 --> 01:02:39,420
bingo game something that night that

1422
01:02:45,590 --> 01:02:42,000
apparently hadn't come to pass or it was

1423
01:02:48,590 --> 01:02:45,600
not worth not not happening and at some

1424
01:02:50,270 --> 01:02:48,600
point in the evening I believe close to

1425
01:02:54,200 --> 01:02:50,280
nine o'clock somewhere eight to nine

1426
01:02:59,360 --> 01:02:54,210
o'clock dark and they were heading home

1427
01:03:02,720 --> 01:02:59,370
and there is a road that pretty well it

1428
01:03:07,010 --> 01:03:02,730
takes a sharp turn or right heading

1429
01:03:09,110 --> 01:03:07,020
directly south Huffman East Gate Huffman

1430
01:03:11,180 --> 01:03:09,120
New Caney anyway pretty well run

1431
01:03:13,640 --> 01:03:11,190
straight north and south from at the

1432
01:03:15,410 --> 01:03:13,650
point they were on it and having been

1433
01:03:17,590 --> 01:03:15,420
there in the past my friend Tommy bland

1434
01:03:20,600 --> 01:03:17,600
and I went there when we visited with

1435
01:03:23,960 --> 01:03:20,610
Vickie Landrum and if you drive down

1436
01:03:27,560 --> 01:03:23,970
this stretch of road back at that point

1437
01:03:29,570 --> 01:03:27,570
a lot of it is actually bordered by tall

1438
01:03:32,720 --> 01:03:29,580
kind of pine trees it's very common in

1439
01:03:35,150 --> 01:03:32,730
that area and it's very narrow I mean

1440
01:03:37,190 --> 01:03:35,160
you have a narrow two-lane road with a

1441
01:03:38,600 --> 01:03:37,200
little bit of a shoulder well no

1442
01:03:40,910 --> 01:03:38,610
effective shoulder it's pretty well

1443
01:03:42,500 --> 01:03:40,920
turns right into the grass and then not

1444
01:03:45,310 --> 01:03:42,510
too far away fence line and then pine

1445
01:03:48,710 --> 01:03:45,320
trees that go you know relatively tall

1446
01:03:50,960 --> 01:03:48,720
so they're heading down this road and I

1447
01:03:52,610 --> 01:03:50,970
believe before they actually began to

1448
01:03:53,990 --> 01:03:52,620
head down the road as they had kind of

1449
01:03:56,570 --> 01:03:54,000
at a position where they could see and

1450
01:03:58,540 --> 01:03:56,580
the sky had noted a bright light kind of

1451
01:04:02,660 --> 01:03:58,550
that direction didn't know what it was

1452
01:04:04,940 --> 01:04:02,670
but at one point Vickie Landrum had told

1453
01:04:06,500 --> 01:04:04,950
us that at first it gave her the

1454
01:04:08,510 --> 01:04:06,510
impression it may have been almost kind

1455
01:04:10,310 --> 01:04:08,520
of horizontal or stretched out I don't

1456
01:04:11,930 --> 01:04:10,320
don't mean to suggest that the object

1457
01:04:14,330 --> 01:04:11,940
itself was in some way moving

1458
01:04:16,280 --> 01:04:14,340
horizontally so to speak but there was

1459
01:04:17,900 --> 01:04:16,290
something unusual about this light then

1460
01:04:19,850 --> 01:04:17,910
they turned down this road and the road

1461
01:04:21,890 --> 01:04:19,860
as I said is there it was at that point

1462
01:04:22,520 --> 01:04:21,900
very narrow with tall pine trees on both

1463
01:04:25,460 --> 01:04:22,530
sides

1464
01:04:26,960 --> 01:04:25,470
and which is an important factor I think

1465
01:04:30,410 --> 01:04:26,970
when you look at the rest of the

1466
01:04:32,060 --> 01:04:30,420
incident and one point they're down this

1467
01:04:33,740 --> 01:04:32,070
road I think the road ran for five or

1468
01:04:36,500 --> 01:04:33,750
ten miles it was a long stretch of road

1469
01:04:41,660 --> 01:04:36,510
and no one else around apparently and

1470
01:04:43,670 --> 01:04:41,670
they're moving down this road and Vickie

1471
01:04:45,770 --> 01:04:43,680
Landrum is riding in the passenger seat

1472
01:04:48,050 --> 01:04:45,780
Betty cash is driving and it's I believe

1473
01:04:51,110 --> 01:04:48,060
Betty Cash's car and Colby's there with

1474
01:04:53,990 --> 01:04:51,120
them and all of a sudden something comes

1475
01:04:56,450 --> 01:04:54,000
over the road and begins to I guess

1476
01:04:58,310 --> 01:04:56,460
mostly visible because of what we'll

1477
01:05:01,460 --> 01:04:58,320
call the flames that were projecting

1478
01:05:05,120 --> 01:05:01,470
from beneath it the object apparently a

1479
01:05:08,060 --> 01:05:05,130
very dark color so there are other

1480
01:05:10,670 --> 01:05:08,070
illustrations that seem to suggest or

1481
01:05:12,380 --> 01:05:10,680
have actually drawn with lights around

1482
01:05:16,040 --> 01:05:12,390
the periphery like portholes you know

1483
01:05:18,800 --> 01:05:16,050
the typical UFO close whatever you want

1484
01:05:21,290 --> 01:05:18,810
to call it but the actual report

1485
01:05:24,350 --> 01:05:21,300
according to the women was a very dark

1486
01:05:28,520 --> 01:05:24,360
object now seemingly triangular but

1487
01:05:31,820 --> 01:05:28,530
almost more of as say two cones turned

1488
01:05:33,380 --> 01:05:31,830
with their wide rims combined and the

1489
01:05:35,000 --> 01:05:33,390
top more rounded so you do have a

1490
01:05:35,570 --> 01:05:35,010
diamond-shaped but I don't mean hard

1491
01:05:38,540 --> 01:05:35,580
edges

1492
01:05:41,870 --> 01:05:38,550
it's more of a cone two cones inverted

1493
01:05:43,760 --> 01:05:41,880
kind of a scenario but a dark shape that

1494
01:05:45,500 --> 01:05:43,770
I think she even told us at one point if

1495
01:05:47,480 --> 01:05:45,510
it hadn't been for the flames coming out

1496
01:05:49,130 --> 01:05:47,490
of the bottom it might have been there

1497
01:05:52,580 --> 01:05:49,140
and no one you would never have seen it

1498
01:05:54,350 --> 01:05:52,590
so ultimately it was dark no lights

1499
01:05:55,880 --> 01:05:54,360
around the perimeter or even though I

1500
01:05:59,150 --> 01:05:55,890
know there's pictures been drawn this

1501
01:06:01,250 --> 01:05:59,160
way but this brilliant reddish flame

1502
01:06:02,690 --> 01:06:01,260
would come out from below it and of

1503
01:06:05,120 --> 01:06:02,700
course they came to a halt as they were

1504
01:06:06,410 --> 01:06:05,130
driving because nura Road I guess you

1505
01:06:07,460 --> 01:06:06,420
could have turned around but it's not

1506
01:06:09,260 --> 01:06:07,470
something you necessarily would have

1507
01:06:11,360 --> 01:06:09,270
thought of doing at that point they

1508
01:06:13,040 --> 01:06:11,370
didn't drive under it but they stopped

1509
01:06:14,600 --> 01:06:13,050
far enough back that apparently this

1510
01:06:17,510 --> 01:06:14,610
thing comes down over the road in front

1511
01:06:21,710 --> 01:06:17,520
of them low enough at some points to

1512
01:06:23,750 --> 01:06:21,720
scorch the surface of the road and the

1513
01:06:26,990 --> 01:06:23,760
way she described it was this thing

1514
01:06:29,120 --> 01:06:27,000
would seem to lower a little bit closer

1515
01:06:31,790 --> 01:06:29,130
to the surface of the road and I mean

1516
01:06:34,400 --> 01:06:31,800
it's apparently down less than the

1517
01:06:35,770 --> 01:06:34,410
treetops to me that was an important

1518
01:06:39,130 --> 01:06:35,780
factor because

1519
01:06:41,410 --> 01:06:39,140
that certainly indicates probably not a

1520
01:06:43,390 --> 01:06:41,420
balloon because if it's drifting along

1521
01:06:45,790 --> 01:06:43,400
with a flame at the bottom it's gonna

1522
01:06:47,140 --> 01:06:45,800
hit those trees so there was some kind

1523
01:06:50,410 --> 01:06:47,150
of control that would allow it to

1524
01:06:52,600 --> 01:06:50,420
descend apparently over where the least

1525
01:06:54,340 --> 01:06:52,610
the asphalt of the road was so the

1526
01:06:57,340 --> 01:06:54,350
flames weren't going to catch the grass

1527
01:07:00,280 --> 01:06:57,350
or the trees on fire but it wasn't a

1528
01:07:01,810 --> 01:07:00,290
rocket exhaust that apparently would be

1529
01:07:03,640 --> 01:07:01,820
required to constant steady or it's

1530
01:07:05,860 --> 01:07:03,650
gonna collapse because this thing

1531
01:07:07,750 --> 01:07:05,870
lowered slightly more over the road the

1532
01:07:09,880 --> 01:07:07,760
flames would burst out much more strong

1533
01:07:11,470 --> 01:07:09,890
and the object would slightly rise back

1534
01:07:13,960 --> 01:07:11,480
up a little bit and then if the flames

1535
01:07:15,610 --> 01:07:13,970
would receive slightly the thing would

1536
01:07:18,490 --> 01:07:15,620
drop a little bit and the flames would

1537
01:07:19,900 --> 01:07:18,500
shoot back out in her impression that

1538
01:07:22,660 --> 01:07:19,910
she got and I'm sure others have as well

1539
01:07:25,740 --> 01:07:22,670
as though it's having difficulty there's

1540
01:07:28,090 --> 01:07:25,750
some problem that it's not able to just

1541
01:07:30,190 --> 01:07:28,100
stay aloft or for some reason that

1542
01:07:32,680 --> 01:07:30,200
needed to come down at some point over

1543
01:07:34,390 --> 01:07:32,690
this roadway I don't think there's any

1544
01:07:37,180 --> 01:07:34,400
reason to believe it was in any way

1545
01:07:38,890 --> 01:07:37,190
focusing on the ladies but it just

1546
01:07:40,510 --> 01:07:38,900
simply came down at this point in the

1547
01:07:42,100 --> 01:07:40,520
dark of night over this roadway and they

1548
01:07:44,260 --> 01:07:42,110
happened to be there and so they stopped

1549
01:07:45,850 --> 01:07:44,270
the car and at one point and of course

1550
01:07:47,620 --> 01:07:45,860
it was apparently terrifying very very

1551
01:07:50,050 --> 01:07:47,630
loud roar I believe there may have been

1552
01:07:52,180 --> 01:07:50,060
at least whether it was an acoustic

1553
01:07:53,980 --> 01:07:52,190
beeping or it was simply some residual

1554
01:07:55,810 --> 01:07:53,990
beeping effect that they believed they

1555
01:07:57,940 --> 01:07:55,820
were hearing you know we hear talk of

1556
01:07:59,260 --> 01:07:57,950
potential some type of a microwave

1557
01:08:01,120 --> 01:07:59,270
radiation or some other bursts that

1558
01:08:03,280 --> 01:08:01,130
would create what appear to be auditory

1559
01:08:05,470 --> 01:08:03,290
effects but needless to say it was very

1560
01:08:07,660 --> 01:08:05,480
loud when this thing when the blast of

1561
01:08:09,850 --> 01:08:07,670
the flames would come out at one point

1562
01:08:14,050 --> 01:08:09,860
Betty cash gets out the driver's side

1563
01:08:16,300 --> 01:08:14,060
and walks to the front left side of the

1564
01:08:19,890 --> 01:08:16,310
car and stands there to get a better

1565
01:08:22,360 --> 01:08:19,900
look at it and possibly maybe probably

1566
01:08:25,090 --> 01:08:22,370
that might have gone from why she seemed

1567
01:08:27,400 --> 01:08:25,100
to fairly quickly get the worst of it I

1568
01:08:29,620 --> 01:08:27,410
had the worst effects an interesting

1569
01:08:32,559 --> 01:08:29,630
point she made though was that when she

1570
01:08:34,450 --> 01:08:32,569
decided Vickie's in the car holding on

1571
01:08:36,430 --> 01:08:34,460
to coal because Colby's frightened and

1572
01:08:38,140 --> 01:08:36,440
she even told us at one point she's

1573
01:08:40,090 --> 01:08:38,150
telling him if you just look and watch

1574
01:08:41,860 --> 01:08:40,100
you'll be okay you'll see Jesus up there

1575
01:08:45,220 --> 01:08:41,870
so she's doing whatever she can say to

1576
01:08:46,690 --> 01:08:45,230
keep him calm and eventually she's

1577
01:08:49,090 --> 01:08:46,700
screaming at Betty to get back in the

1578
01:08:49,599 --> 01:08:49,100
car Betty cash goes back and even made

1579
01:08:59,229 --> 01:08:49,609
the

1580
01:09:01,629 --> 01:08:59,239
whatever was causing you know was coming

1581
01:09:04,479 --> 01:09:01,639
off the object it was putting out enough

1582
01:09:06,340 --> 01:09:04,489
heat even Vickie later on said that when

1583
01:09:08,169 --> 01:09:06,350
she had had her hand on the - course if

1584
01:09:09,669 --> 01:09:08,179
we all remember back in those days they

1585
01:09:12,280 --> 01:09:09,679
were kind of these cushioned dashboards

1586
01:09:14,559 --> 01:09:12,290
but that apparently it must may be

1587
01:09:17,079 --> 01:09:14,569
softened enough and I'm telling you this

1588
01:09:19,149 --> 01:09:17,089
is what I heard there are aspects of

1589
01:09:22,090 --> 01:09:19,159
this that she also told us that later on

1590
01:09:23,620 --> 01:09:22,100
I realized memories being what they are

1591
01:09:26,320 --> 01:09:23,630
and I think by the time we were talking

1592
01:09:27,700 --> 01:09:26,330
- it was 1985 so it was five years or so

1593
01:09:30,399 --> 01:09:27,710
afterwards when we decided to go down

1594
01:09:33,910 --> 01:09:30,409
there and try to do it find out what we

1595
01:09:36,160 --> 01:09:33,920
could but we sat in her house and I've

1596
01:09:38,079 --> 01:09:36,170
recorded video with her describing and

1597
01:09:39,430 --> 01:09:38,089
I've got tapes of her talking about a

1598
01:09:42,879 --> 01:09:39,440
lot of this stuff and I've said some of

1599
01:09:44,470 --> 01:09:42,889
that I think information - - uh Kurt

1600
01:09:48,579 --> 01:09:44,480
Collins because he's done a lot of

1601
01:09:51,729 --> 01:09:48,589
writing on the subject but ultimately as

1602
01:09:53,890 --> 01:09:51,739
they're watching this thing they began

1603
01:09:55,090 --> 01:09:53,900
to see helicopters coming in and at one

1604
01:09:57,280 --> 01:09:55,100
point they said one of them was low

1605
01:09:59,320 --> 01:09:57,290
enough they could almost have looked

1606
01:09:59,890 --> 01:09:59,330
through the cockpit and maybe seen who's

1607
01:10:02,500 --> 01:09:59,900
in there

1608
01:10:04,419 --> 01:10:02,510
but the object was still hovering over

1609
01:10:06,220 --> 01:10:04,429
this road although it begins to rise up

1610
01:10:09,040 --> 01:10:06,230
slightly when the helicopters began to

1611
01:10:11,140 --> 01:10:09,050
come in and in her words the words of

1612
01:10:13,660 --> 01:10:11,150
Vickie Landrum to us she said as it

1613
01:10:15,250 --> 01:10:13,670
finally began to lift off as though

1614
01:10:17,560 --> 01:10:15,260
whatever the issue might have been

1615
01:10:20,350 --> 01:10:17,570
somehow was resolved and it's able to

1616
01:10:23,020 --> 01:10:20,360
kind of take on off I don't believe the

1617
01:10:25,180 --> 01:10:23,030
flames were coming out as harder as far

1618
01:10:27,129 --> 01:10:25,190
as they had been at that point but as it

1619
01:10:29,169 --> 01:10:27,139
lifts off and begins to move away and

1620
01:10:30,609 --> 01:10:29,179
they're finally in the car now and they

1621
01:10:31,750 --> 01:10:30,619
began to move down they reached a point

1622
01:10:33,280 --> 01:10:31,760
in the road where they could look off to

1623
01:10:35,320 --> 01:10:33,290
the right because they were driving

1624
01:10:36,609 --> 01:10:35,330
south they can look off to the right and

1625
01:10:38,470 --> 01:10:36,619
see the object with all these

1626
01:10:40,149 --> 01:10:38,480
helicopters around it and she said it

1627
01:10:42,669 --> 01:10:40,159
was almost like some of the helicopters

1628
01:10:45,780 --> 01:10:42,679
over the top of it and her words almost

1629
01:10:48,160 --> 01:10:45,790
like they were trying to hem it in now

1630
01:10:51,760 --> 01:10:48,170
observation wise so there were you go so

1631
01:10:54,370 --> 01:10:51,770
eventually they go on home and that

1632
01:10:56,620 --> 01:10:54,380
essentially is the gist of the encounter

1633
01:11:00,419 --> 01:10:56,630
that they had that night it's not until

1634
01:11:03,419 --> 01:11:00,429
the next day of course that apparently

1635
01:11:05,879 --> 01:11:03,429
Vicki goes to check on Betty and Betty's

1636
01:11:07,379 --> 01:11:05,889
a really hard way you know her she's had

1637
01:11:09,839 --> 01:11:07,389
a lot of the apparent the effects that

1638
01:11:12,600 --> 01:11:09,849
ultimately caused our hair to fall out

1639
01:11:14,310 --> 01:11:12,610
and her face to swell up I believe in

1640
01:11:16,439 --> 01:11:14,320
eyes and of course they didn't know at

1641
01:11:17,729 --> 01:11:16,449
that point they don't want to test

1642
01:11:20,969 --> 01:11:17,739
necessarily tell anybody what the issue

1643
01:11:25,169 --> 01:11:20,979
is but ultimately when they go to the

1644
01:11:29,370 --> 01:11:25,179
doctor and the doctors kind of wondering

1645
01:11:31,589 --> 01:11:29,380
what's going on and I think even if I'm

1646
01:11:34,049 --> 01:11:31,599
not my memory is correct it was kind of

1647
01:11:35,399 --> 01:11:34,059
ask the doctor if you tell him what if

1648
01:11:38,489 --> 01:11:35,409
they'd have any idea what caused this

1649
01:11:41,370 --> 01:11:38,499
and it was may have been Colby who kind

1650
01:11:43,199 --> 01:11:41,380
of said well yeah and you know and then

1651
01:11:45,000 --> 01:11:43,209
they began to tell the story that they

1652
01:11:47,459 --> 01:11:45,010
had this odd encounter on the highway

1653
01:11:49,259 --> 01:11:47,469
and that obviously Betty got the worst

1654
01:11:51,239 --> 01:11:49,269
of it even though Vicki had some

1655
01:11:53,819 --> 01:11:51,249
residual effects she had some pictures

1656
01:11:56,219 --> 01:11:53,829
you can see them online about dart marks

1657
01:11:57,449 --> 01:11:56,229
and spots on her hands were the skin

1658
01:11:59,429 --> 01:11:57,459
apparently happened to have been

1659
01:12:03,239 --> 01:11:59,439
blistered or at least had some effects

1660
01:12:05,459 --> 01:12:03,249
and I believe it was weeks afterwards

1661
01:12:06,810 --> 01:12:05,469
before it ultimately began to get out

1662
01:12:08,279 --> 01:12:06,820
you know they've gone to the doctor and

1663
01:12:12,209 --> 01:12:08,289
the story began to get out and I think

1664
01:12:15,089 --> 01:12:12,219
they finally called my Billy MUFON which

1665
01:12:17,939 --> 01:12:15,099
led to John Schuessler and his team

1666
01:12:21,120 --> 01:12:17,949
getting involved but there were aspects

1667
01:12:23,129 --> 01:12:21,130
to this story that I know have gotten

1668
01:12:26,669 --> 01:12:23,139
confused over time one of them that

1669
01:12:28,229 --> 01:12:26,679
threw me and ultimately and talking to

1670
01:12:29,790 --> 01:12:28,239
Kirk Collins even it became obvious that

1671
01:12:33,149 --> 01:12:29,800
it could not have been the way she

1672
01:12:35,459 --> 01:12:33,159
remembered it and it was she told us

1673
01:12:38,459 --> 01:12:35,469
sitting there that apparently within

1674
01:12:41,189 --> 01:12:38,469
days of the incident somebody came in

1675
01:12:42,719 --> 01:12:41,199
and Tora the road hauled all of it off

1676
01:12:47,429 --> 01:12:42,729
and resurfaced that whole stretch of

1677
01:12:49,890 --> 01:12:47,439
road and I repeated that because that's

1678
01:12:51,629 --> 01:12:49,900
what she told us but ultimately you

1679
01:12:53,129 --> 01:12:51,639
realized but I don't think it was until

1680
01:12:55,439 --> 01:12:53,139
maybe near the end of February before

1681
01:12:57,810 --> 01:12:55,449
John Schuessler and his team got out

1682
01:12:59,879 --> 01:12:57,820
there looking for this and they claimed

1683
01:13:01,469 --> 01:12:59,889
that they found a place in the road that

1684
01:13:03,569 --> 01:13:01,479
appeared where the scorched area had

1685
01:13:05,819 --> 01:13:03,579
been but if that's the case then it

1686
01:13:07,350 --> 01:13:05,829
couldn't have been replaced a few day or

1687
01:13:09,449 --> 01:13:07,360
within a week or so after the incident

1688
01:13:11,189 --> 01:13:09,459
so I think there's some confusion about

1689
01:13:13,500 --> 01:13:11,199
it and oh by the time we got there oh

1690
01:13:16,199 --> 01:13:13,510
yeah that road definitely at some point

1691
01:13:17,080 --> 01:13:16,209
somebody resurfaced that entire stretch

1692
01:13:20,500 --> 01:13:17,090
of road

1693
01:13:22,300 --> 01:13:20,510
but it could have been much later months

1694
01:13:24,700 --> 01:13:22,310
later maybe it was a part of a natural

1695
01:13:26,560 --> 01:13:24,710
thing one of the thoughts that I

1696
01:13:30,130 --> 01:13:26,570
recalled at the time which I still

1697
01:13:32,500 --> 01:13:30,140
remember to this day is it's very was

1698
01:13:33,910 --> 01:13:32,510
very nondescript there are pictures you

1699
01:13:36,880 --> 01:13:33,920
can still find of what it was like back

1700
01:13:38,800 --> 01:13:36,890
then but even that part of the road in

1701
01:13:40,870 --> 01:13:38,810
the dark I mean it's not like it's lined

1702
01:13:42,070 --> 01:13:40,880
a lot not mag van it's not it wasn't

1703
01:13:43,990 --> 01:13:42,080
lined with street lights all the way

1704
01:13:46,470 --> 01:13:44,000
down so you'll know exactly where you

1705
01:13:49,300 --> 01:13:46,480
are and there were a few cross streets

1706
01:13:52,330 --> 01:13:49,310
but given a span of a hundred yards or

1707
01:13:53,530 --> 01:13:52,340
200 yards in the dark of night with an

1708
01:13:57,250 --> 01:13:53,540
object in front of you that you're

1709
01:14:00,160 --> 01:13:57,260
focusing on I don't know how easy it

1710
01:14:03,130 --> 01:14:00,170
would be to go back a month to my three

1711
01:14:06,010 --> 01:14:03,140
months later even in the daytime and say

1712
01:14:07,960 --> 01:14:06,020
this is exactly where we were and that's

1713
01:14:09,670 --> 01:14:07,970
where the Scorch in the road was or

1714
01:14:13,150 --> 01:14:09,680
that's what the residual effects of the

1715
01:14:15,160 --> 01:14:13,160
object were because if you move a

1716
01:14:17,260 --> 01:14:15,170
hundred yards down the road it looks the

1717
01:14:19,240 --> 01:14:17,270
same and in the middle of the night

1718
01:14:21,550 --> 01:14:19,250
unless you were at a cross intersection

1719
01:14:23,230 --> 01:14:21,560
or you had some specific landmark that

1720
01:14:26,230 --> 01:14:23,240
would tell you and so I've I've always

1721
01:14:28,420 --> 01:14:26,240
had never been quite certain that

1722
01:14:31,020 --> 01:14:28,430
somebody could come back later and and

1723
01:14:33,010 --> 01:14:31,030
say this is the exact spot and no that's

1724
01:14:34,570 --> 01:14:33,020
but I know things that would have done

1725
01:14:36,010 --> 01:14:34,580
different I did have some experiences

1726
01:14:38,890 --> 01:14:36,020
trying to track down the helicopters

1727
01:14:41,860 --> 01:14:38,900
where I even sent off an FOI request to

1728
01:14:43,360 --> 01:14:41,870
the weather department asking for radar

1729
01:14:46,450 --> 01:14:43,370
because you know I'd been told that a a

1730
01:14:48,240 --> 01:14:46,460
group of helicopters of that size would

1731
01:14:51,480 --> 01:14:48,250
ultimately show up even on weather radar

1732
01:14:54,790 --> 01:14:51,490
you'd have at least some indication of

1733
01:14:57,040 --> 01:14:54,800
movement and I requested the 8

1734
01:14:58,750 --> 01:14:57,050
millimeter no film that apparently they

1735
01:15:02,230 --> 01:14:58,760
take of the weather radar back then all

1736
01:15:05,440 --> 01:15:02,240
through that time period and of course

1737
01:15:07,570 --> 01:15:05,450
those two days it's as though they turn

1738
01:15:10,090 --> 01:15:07,580
the radar off there was nothing for

1739
01:15:12,870 --> 01:15:10,100
those two days when that the flight of

1740
01:15:15,100 --> 01:15:12,880
helicopters might have shown up but

1741
01:15:17,380 --> 01:15:15,110
Jacques valets made some comments about

1742
01:15:19,240 --> 01:15:17,390
the helicopters came from this place or

1743
01:15:22,450 --> 01:15:19,250
that place and I even wrote to Fort Hood

1744
01:15:25,420 --> 01:15:22,460
which was the only base here close to

1745
01:15:27,820 --> 01:15:25,430
Killeen that might have had a squadron

1746
01:15:29,890 --> 01:15:27,830
of helicopters of that size

1747
01:15:33,400 --> 01:15:29,900
and they did make an interesting comment

1748
01:15:36,750 --> 01:15:33,410
that on that night there was a group of

1749
01:15:40,540 --> 01:15:36,760
helicopters that came in for effect I

1750
01:15:42,070 --> 01:15:40,550
have no idea exactly what that means but

1751
01:15:43,360 --> 01:15:42,080
it was at least some acknowledgment

1752
01:15:45,460 --> 01:15:43,370
there were helicopters out that night

1753
01:15:47,980 --> 01:15:45,470
from Fort Hood no further they were

1754
01:15:50,050 --> 01:15:47,990
involved Rob but go ahead you know I

1755
01:15:52,480 --> 01:15:50,060
wanted to actually bring in that general

1756
01:15:54,640 --> 01:15:52,490
touch on this topic I wanted to

1757
01:15:56,860 --> 01:15:54,650
introduce him and we've had Jen on

1758
01:15:59,320 --> 01:15:56,870
before he's a wonderful person he's

1759
01:16:04,240 --> 01:15:59,330
extremely well known and he's a veteran

1760
01:16:08,170 --> 01:16:04,250
UFO researcher he's since 1995 and jen

1761
01:16:10,990 --> 01:16:08,180
has worked full-time on project 1947

1762
01:16:14,710 --> 01:16:11,000
it's a research effort funded by Koufos

1763
01:16:17,230 --> 01:16:14,720
flew for and MUFON now called the UFO

1764
01:16:19,870 --> 01:16:17,240
research coalition he has visited over

1765
01:16:23,200 --> 01:16:19,880
150 libraries universities archives

1766
01:16:26,140 --> 01:16:23,210
museums and historical societies in 46

1767
01:16:29,290 --> 01:16:26,150
states and Canadian provinces John delve

1768
01:16:29,890 --> 01:16:29,300
into the MUFON UFO FILES when he visited

1769
01:16:31,830 --> 01:16:29,900
sequinned

1770
01:16:34,420 --> 01:16:31,840
Texas former location of MUFON

1771
01:16:36,070 --> 01:16:34,430
headquarters I did have a question for

1772
01:16:37,780 --> 01:16:36,080
you right after I introduced you Jan on

1773
01:16:49,170 --> 01:16:37,790
this topic but welcome to the show we're

1774
01:16:53,230 --> 01:16:51,490
okay Jan let's get right to it I had a

1775
01:16:55,390 --> 01:16:53,240
question for you on this cache Landrum

1776
01:16:58,540 --> 01:16:55,400
incident and so it's kind of a different

1777
01:17:00,820 --> 01:16:58,550
question and that is this would it be

1778
01:17:05,890 --> 01:17:00,830
correct to say that there have been

1779
01:17:08,050 --> 01:17:05,900
multiple UFO sightings and reports near

1780
01:17:10,870 --> 01:17:08,060
nuclear facilities the reason why I

1781
01:17:15,130 --> 01:17:10,880
asked that is because of this radiation

1782
01:17:17,290 --> 01:17:15,140
related situation regarding this person

1783
01:17:21,430 --> 01:17:17,300
possibly having been exposed to some

1784
01:17:23,740 --> 01:17:21,440
unknown craft I realize my question is

1785
01:17:25,540 --> 01:17:23,750
slightly different than that but I just

1786
01:17:27,190 --> 01:17:25,550
wanted to get some data from you on that

1787
01:17:30,760 --> 01:17:27,200
because you're kind of the data guy

1788
01:17:32,200 --> 01:17:30,770
regarding ufology are there any UFOs

1789
01:17:35,530 --> 01:17:32,210
that have the reported near nuclear

1790
01:17:37,360 --> 01:17:35,540
facilities is that a pattern well yeah

1791
01:17:40,500 --> 01:17:37,370
there are a lot of them and sometimes

1792
01:17:42,930 --> 01:17:40,510
they interact with the

1793
01:17:47,280 --> 01:17:42,940
the guards and the other personnel at

1794
01:17:49,500 --> 01:17:47,290
the facilities so but let me point one

1795
01:17:52,020 --> 01:17:49,510
thing out when we're talking about you

1796
01:17:54,590 --> 01:17:52,030
know everybody gets it you know this is

1797
01:17:58,919 --> 01:17:54,600
very exciting this is the sexy part of

1798
01:18:05,160 --> 01:17:58,929
anthology something that is more mundane

1799
01:18:11,070 --> 01:18:05,170
is that another group of people who are

1800
01:18:14,030 --> 01:18:11,080
always outside but not with the not 24/7

1801
01:18:19,530 --> 01:18:14,040
but they are outside a lot of times is

1802
01:18:23,490 --> 01:18:19,540
farmers and they interact with UFOs many

1803
01:18:30,470 --> 01:18:23,500
times too and I I want to sometime do we

1804
01:18:38,580 --> 01:18:33,750
they may be interested the UFOs may

1805
01:18:40,950 --> 01:18:38,590
appear near nuclear facilities but they

1806
01:18:48,060 --> 01:18:40,960
also appear other places where people

1807
01:18:52,080 --> 01:18:48,070
are out and can see them in in the early

1808
01:18:57,439 --> 01:18:52,090
morning and things like that one other

1809
01:19:03,860 --> 01:18:57,449
thing about there are a number of cases

1810
01:19:10,140 --> 01:19:03,870
where radiation is involved a winner in

1811
01:19:13,020 --> 01:19:10,150
in North Dakota or South Dakota there's

1812
01:19:15,140 --> 01:19:13,030
a landing and then the National Guard

1813
01:19:17,939 --> 01:19:15,150
went up there and checked it out with

1814
01:19:23,100 --> 01:19:17,949
with Geiger counters and found where the

1815
01:19:25,770 --> 01:19:23,110
UFO had landed there was a race there

1816
01:19:29,750 --> 01:19:25,780
was a higher rate of your activities in

1817
01:19:34,830 --> 01:19:29,760
background a lot higher and of course

1818
01:19:38,550 --> 01:19:34,840
there's a there's about a dozen of these

1819
01:19:43,919 --> 01:19:38,560
things we're actually instruments have

1820
01:19:48,200 --> 01:19:43,929
checked and there is increases in radio

1821
01:19:53,610 --> 01:19:48,210
radiation so it's it's not unheard of

1822
01:19:54,830 --> 01:19:53,620
the other thing about the physiological

1823
01:20:00,750 --> 01:19:54,840
effect

1824
01:20:03,030 --> 01:20:00,760
now I have swords is catalog here he's

1825
01:20:07,080 --> 01:20:03,040
got a hundred and sixty four cases in

1826
01:20:13,340 --> 01:20:07,090
his catalog and since we have been doing

1827
01:20:16,110 --> 01:20:13,350
the the scanning of the Koufos files and

1828
01:20:22,590 --> 01:20:16,120
Greenwoods files in my own files and

1829
01:20:29,149 --> 01:20:22,600
people like Willie Smith dr. Willie

1830
01:20:36,780 --> 01:20:29,159
Smith and some people from England and

1831
01:20:39,410 --> 01:20:36,790
Canada there are there are radiation

1832
01:20:42,090 --> 01:20:39,420
cases and there are a lot more

1833
01:20:46,169 --> 01:20:42,100
physiological cases whereas where people

1834
01:20:47,729 --> 01:20:46,179
are affected then then swords had not

1835
01:20:49,979 --> 01:20:47,739
saying that he didn't do a good and

1836
01:20:50,939 --> 01:20:49,989
thorough job it's just that there is so

1837
01:20:56,010 --> 01:20:50,949
much data

1838
01:20:57,780 --> 01:20:56,020
it's like Hynek said we've got an

1839
01:21:00,959 --> 01:20:57,790
embarrassment of riches and we don't

1840
01:21:03,390 --> 01:21:00,969
know what to do with it yeah I wanted to

1841
01:21:04,830 --> 01:21:03,400
make a comment on the radiation aspect

1842
01:21:09,270 --> 01:21:04,840
of this thank you very much for that

1843
01:21:13,050 --> 01:21:09,280
information Jan mmm this poor lady

1844
01:21:15,030 --> 01:21:13,060
involved in cash Landrum incident she

1845
01:21:18,720 --> 01:21:15,040
said that her symptoms worsened so she

1846
01:21:21,300 --> 01:21:18,730
did actually go to the hospital for 12

1847
01:21:23,790 --> 01:21:21,310
days she then was released and then she

1848
01:21:26,430 --> 01:21:23,800
went ahead and decided to go back for

1849
01:21:28,890 --> 01:21:26,440
another 15 days a radiologist who

1850
01:21:31,290 --> 01:21:28,900
examined the witnesses medical records

1851
01:21:34,320 --> 01:21:31,300
for MUFON did indicate that he felt that

1852
01:21:37,590 --> 01:21:34,330
these patients had suffered secondary

1853
01:21:39,479 --> 01:21:37,600
damage to ionizing radiation and they

1854
01:21:41,370 --> 01:21:39,489
just wanted to make a comment to all of

1855
01:21:44,700 --> 01:21:41,380
our listeners I've been through breast

1856
01:21:46,620 --> 01:21:44,710
cancer twice in a row I had to go

1857
01:21:48,510 --> 01:21:46,630
through radiation and I had to go

1858
01:21:51,300 --> 01:21:48,520
through different kinds two different

1859
01:21:56,850 --> 01:21:51,310
kinds direct beam and breaky related

1860
01:21:58,560 --> 01:21:56,860
radiation and I got very sick and and it

1861
01:22:00,540 --> 01:21:58,570
wasn't just like one time it was

1862
01:22:03,689 --> 01:22:00,550
multiple times regarding direct beam

1863
01:22:06,629 --> 01:22:03,699
radiation and I can just tell you and

1864
01:22:07,339 --> 01:22:06,639
that if this poor lady or multiple folks

1865
01:22:09,259 --> 01:22:07,349
actually

1866
01:22:13,759 --> 01:22:09,269
to go through some kind of radiation

1867
01:22:15,379 --> 01:22:13,769
exposure I can only imagine what they

1868
01:22:18,080 --> 01:22:15,389
went through especially since it was not

1869
01:22:21,799 --> 01:22:18,090
in a controlled environment but it was

1870
01:22:23,119 --> 01:22:21,809
just raw exposure so to speak wanted to

1871
01:22:26,359 --> 01:22:23,129
also bring up an interesting topic

1872
01:22:29,929 --> 01:22:26,369
really fast and then go back to both you

1873
01:22:32,989 --> 01:22:29,939
and Jen and Christian on this and that

1874
01:22:36,709 --> 01:22:32,999
is Stanton Friedman in a skeptical

1875
01:22:38,750 --> 01:22:36,719
article I'm sorry interview was asked

1876
01:22:40,429 --> 01:22:38,760
about telepathy I'm actually going

1877
01:22:42,889 --> 01:22:40,439
somewhere with this regarding what

1878
01:22:44,750 --> 01:22:42,899
Christian mentioned about this lady and

1879
01:22:46,849 --> 01:22:44,760
the road that she said had been worked

1880
01:22:50,500 --> 01:22:46,859
on and there was no evidence to you of

1881
01:22:53,599 --> 01:22:50,510
that he mentioned this I'll go ahead and

1882
01:22:56,719 --> 01:22:53,609
give a quote regarding the topic of

1883
01:22:58,399 --> 01:22:56,729
telepathy and Stan Friedman said well

1884
01:23:00,469 --> 01:22:58,409
it's very interesting point because I'm

1885
01:23:02,419 --> 01:23:00,479
convinced that any advanced civilization

1886
01:23:04,279 --> 01:23:02,429
will know about telepathy and mind

1887
01:23:06,649 --> 01:23:04,289
control and communication at a distance

1888
01:23:08,359 --> 01:23:06,659
it really came home to me when I was

1889
01:23:10,520 --> 01:23:08,369
standing at the exact location where

1890
01:23:12,379 --> 01:23:10,530
Barney Hill was standing when the saucer

1891
01:23:14,319 --> 01:23:12,389
was over their car and he's looking

1892
01:23:16,899 --> 01:23:14,329
through binoculars at the crew on board

1893
01:23:19,580 --> 01:23:16,909
and then he goes on to explain that

1894
01:23:24,589 --> 01:23:19,590
Barney for no good reasons that he can

1895
01:23:26,060 --> 01:23:24,599
explain or can be explained he he

1896
01:23:29,959 --> 01:23:26,070
basically went through a series of

1897
01:23:32,629 --> 01:23:29,969
actions and Stan Friedman believed it

1898
01:23:35,839 --> 01:23:32,639
was through some kind of control from

1899
01:23:38,599 --> 01:23:35,849
beings on that ship that Barney felt

1900
01:23:41,060 --> 01:23:38,609
that he was exposed to that he was

1901
01:23:43,580 --> 01:23:41,070
actually being manipulated to do certain

1902
01:23:45,889 --> 01:23:43,590
things now my point here is wanted to

1903
01:23:48,349 --> 01:23:45,899
ask you Christian do you think it's

1904
01:23:51,109 --> 01:23:48,359
possible that this lady who really

1905
01:23:53,209 --> 01:23:51,119
believed that a certain event happened

1906
01:23:56,060 --> 01:23:53,219
but didn't happen in the chronological

1907
01:23:58,369 --> 01:23:56,070
order necessarily that she claimed it

1908
01:24:00,830 --> 01:23:58,379
did or maybe it didn't happen at all

1909
01:24:04,069 --> 01:24:00,840
do you think it's possible that if she

1910
01:24:06,649 --> 01:24:04,079
was exposed to some kind of ET

1911
01:24:08,509 --> 01:24:06,659
civilization if they manipulated her

1912
01:24:10,160 --> 01:24:08,519
mind into believing that is that a

1913
01:24:11,959 --> 01:24:10,170
possibility huh I

1914
01:24:13,220 --> 01:24:11,969
would never at this state I would not

1915
01:24:16,130 --> 01:24:13,230
have gone that far and it never occurred

1916
01:24:18,740 --> 01:24:16,140
to me and I might also mention that of

1917
01:24:28,220 --> 01:24:18,750
course it was a cache who had gotten out

1918
01:24:29,570 --> 01:24:28,230
of and and had them again

1919
01:24:31,220 --> 01:24:29,580
and although I spoke with her on the

1920
01:24:32,870 --> 01:24:31,230
phone a few times I never had any

1921
01:24:35,570 --> 01:24:32,880
personal interaction with her beyond

1922
01:24:36,890 --> 01:24:35,580
that so what her own feelings about that

1923
01:24:38,570 --> 01:24:36,900
might have been perhaps John Schuessler

1924
01:24:40,820 --> 01:24:38,580
and some of his information had more on

1925
01:24:46,189 --> 01:24:40,830
that Betty Kootenai Vickie Landrum who I

1926
01:24:48,860 --> 01:24:46,199
spoke with I think it's I think it was

1927
01:24:50,419 --> 01:24:48,870
one of those things that is a really

1928
01:24:52,310 --> 01:24:50,429
telling thing to say the road was

1929
01:24:54,620 --> 01:24:52,320
chopped up and and hauled off and

1930
01:24:56,630 --> 01:24:54,630
repaved and somewhere in the

1931
01:24:58,580 --> 01:24:56,640
conversation over those next five years

1932
01:25:01,520 --> 01:24:58,590
from when it happened and by the time I

1933
01:25:05,810 --> 01:25:01,530
spoke with her it kind of became part of

1934
01:25:08,150 --> 01:25:05,820
the story the storytelling and I I don't

1935
01:25:10,729 --> 01:25:08,160
hold anything I mean I don't think she

1936
01:25:13,010 --> 01:25:10,739
knowingly or otherwise was confabulating

1937
01:25:14,840 --> 01:25:13,020
it I think it was simply she's telling

1938
01:25:16,640 --> 01:25:14,850
us that she had heard from people who

1939
01:25:19,459 --> 01:25:16,650
were living in the area that not long

1940
01:25:21,770 --> 01:25:19,469
afterward the road was chopped up I

1941
01:25:24,020 --> 01:25:21,780
think yeah I definitely was eventually

1942
01:25:26,360 --> 01:25:24,030
resurfaced now whether it was six months

1943
01:25:28,370 --> 01:25:26,370
later I don't know if it had been done

1944
01:25:30,620 --> 01:25:28,380
within a week or two which was the

1945
01:25:33,530 --> 01:25:30,630
impression that was left with you know

1946
01:25:34,850 --> 01:25:33,540
when I when she told it to me I had you

1947
01:25:35,840 --> 01:25:34,860
know I believed that she's telling me

1948
01:25:38,600 --> 01:25:35,850
what she believes is true and I think

1949
01:25:41,150 --> 01:25:38,610
she was but it sounded like something

1950
01:25:42,410 --> 01:25:41,160
she had heard from other people and had

1951
01:25:44,330 --> 01:25:42,420
just decided it must have happened right

1952
01:25:47,330 --> 01:25:44,340
after the incident certainly sounds

1953
01:25:48,890 --> 01:25:47,340
better than that way but if John came

1954
01:25:50,209 --> 01:25:48,900
two months later or at the end of

1955
01:25:51,560 --> 01:25:50,219
February whenever he did his initial

1956
01:25:53,540 --> 01:25:51,570
investigation and actually was able to

1957
01:25:56,060 --> 01:25:53,550
think he found in other words he would

1958
01:25:58,100 --> 01:25:56,070
have seen the road paved all evidence

1959
01:25:59,810 --> 01:25:58,110
would have been gone at that point so

1960
01:26:02,150 --> 01:25:59,820
for him to actually have found what he

1961
01:26:04,040 --> 01:26:02,160
thought was where the road was damaged

1962
01:26:06,200 --> 01:26:04,050
I almost tells you right there the road

1963
01:26:08,540 --> 01:26:06,210
can't have been chopped up and hauled

1964
01:26:10,100 --> 01:26:08,550
away so it just goes to show you've got

1965
01:26:11,240 --> 01:26:10,110
to be careful with memories the witness

1966
01:26:13,459 --> 01:26:11,250
is telling you what they believe is

1967
01:26:14,900 --> 01:26:13,469
absolutely true and it may be it just

1968
01:26:20,300 --> 01:26:14,910
didn't quite happen in the order of

1969
01:26:22,700 --> 01:26:20,310
things it doesn't that has this it's the

1970
01:26:23,540 --> 01:26:22,710
case or have any effective the case it's

1971
01:26:27,229 --> 01:26:23,550
just

1972
01:26:30,080 --> 01:26:27,239
the after story that somebody chopped up

1973
01:26:31,399 --> 01:26:30,090
the road and hauled it off maybe once

1974
01:26:32,899 --> 01:26:31,409
they found they'd gone public and mal

1975
01:26:34,490 --> 01:26:32,909
Miu finds investigating all this and

1976
01:26:36,439 --> 01:26:34,500
somebody did want to go back then and

1977
01:26:37,729 --> 01:26:36,449
get rid of the evidence but we could not

1978
01:26:40,010 --> 01:26:37,739
all day on that

1979
01:26:43,609 --> 01:26:40,020
okay so Jan I wanted to ask you about

1980
01:26:45,620 --> 01:26:43,619
something interesting that is in this

1981
01:26:47,930 --> 01:26:45,630
cache Landrum case there were

1982
01:26:50,839 --> 01:26:47,940
helicopters involved I guess they were

1983
01:26:54,379 --> 01:26:50,849
Chinook helicopters wanted to ask you

1984
01:26:57,350 --> 01:26:54,389
are there cases that you have found

1985
01:26:59,839 --> 01:26:57,360
where black helicopters or helicopters

1986
01:27:05,260 --> 01:26:59,849
of any kind have had anything to do with

1987
01:27:11,209 --> 01:27:08,330
helicopters or UFOs are sighted from

1988
01:27:18,680 --> 01:27:11,219
helicopters so I guess you could say

1989
01:27:20,569 --> 01:27:18,690
there was now I the only incident I had

1990
01:27:25,930 --> 01:27:20,579
were there were supposedly black

1991
01:27:31,549 --> 01:27:25,940
helicopters you know the the military

1992
01:27:33,589 --> 01:27:31,559
helicopters are painted rather with

1993
01:27:37,399 --> 01:27:33,599
camouflage and a lot of times it's dark

1994
01:27:39,379 --> 01:27:37,409
especially at night so we had one out

1995
01:27:41,870 --> 01:27:39,389
here where there was a helicopter in the

1996
01:27:44,000 --> 01:27:41,880
area they didn't appear to be looking

1997
01:27:50,930 --> 01:27:44,010
for the UFO and it was just a regular

1998
01:27:56,120 --> 01:27:50,940
Gila copter flight out of the old

1999
01:27:58,490 --> 01:27:56,130
Rentschler Field I think so that that's

2000
01:28:01,250 --> 01:27:58,500
the only close experience I've had two

2001
01:28:05,530 --> 01:28:01,260
helicopters now I talked to pilots that

2002
01:28:11,660 --> 01:28:05,540
have been on helicopters and seen a UFO

2003
01:28:15,169 --> 01:28:11,670
and Weinstein's catalog yeah the French

2004
01:28:20,089 --> 01:28:15,179
anti-terrorist guy that he and I worked

2005
01:28:25,580 --> 01:28:20,099
on a catalog of UFO sightings from

2006
01:28:30,580 --> 01:28:25,590
aircraft he has a number of these cases

2007
01:28:34,069 --> 01:28:30,590
in there not anywhere close to you know

2008
01:28:36,560 --> 01:28:34,079
what you know fixed-wing aircraft but

2009
01:28:39,380 --> 01:28:36,570
there there are there are cases

2010
01:28:41,030 --> 01:28:39,390
well that's a coin case in Ohio is they

2011
01:28:43,040 --> 01:28:41,040
add a little bit more than just deciding

2012
01:28:47,690 --> 01:28:43,050
there yeah yeah that's a that's a that's

2013
01:28:50,720 --> 01:28:47,700
a great physical there's some kind of

2014
01:28:52,690 --> 01:28:50,730
physical thing physical effect that's

2015
01:28:56,080 --> 01:28:52,700
that's what I'm working on

2016
01:29:00,560 --> 01:28:56,090
electromagnetic effects radiation

2017
01:29:09,830 --> 01:29:00,570
physical effects physiological effects

2018
01:29:13,400 --> 01:29:09,840
and even AHS effects and yeah it's hard

2019
01:29:16,180 --> 01:29:13,410
to say about cash Landrum I I'd like to

2020
01:29:24,020 --> 01:29:16,190
hear what Christian has to say about

2021
01:29:26,000 --> 01:29:24,030
Kirk Collins well you know he's an

2022
01:29:28,550 --> 01:29:26,010
independent researcher and in fact I've

2023
01:29:30,740 --> 01:29:28,560
never had an issue with Kirk you know I

2024
01:29:33,350 --> 01:29:30,750
I was actually doing some original

2025
01:29:34,940 --> 01:29:33,360
graphics on computer graphics and

2026
01:29:36,410 --> 01:29:34,950
experiment back in the day and that's

2027
01:29:38,690 --> 01:29:36,420
kind of when I came up with that really

2028
01:29:41,750 --> 01:29:38,700
read illustration of the cash Landrum

2029
01:29:43,670 --> 01:29:41,760
case which yeah I'll admit it may be

2030
01:29:47,810 --> 01:29:43,680
rudimentary based on what I could do at

2031
01:29:49,760 --> 01:29:47,820
the time but but he's done a lot of work

2032
01:29:53,720 --> 01:29:49,770
in collecting information on his blue

2033
01:29:55,160 --> 01:29:53,730
blurry lines and more power to him as

2034
01:29:58,880 --> 01:29:55,170
far as that's concerned I don't know

2035
01:30:02,870 --> 01:29:58,890
that there will ever be any resolution

2036
01:30:05,390 --> 01:30:02,880
of what happened to them unless someone

2037
01:30:08,150 --> 01:30:05,400
got into office and completely opened up

2038
01:30:11,300 --> 01:30:08,160
access to to look into their to the case

2039
01:30:14,000 --> 01:30:11,310
you know they went to court that was a

2040
01:30:15,790 --> 01:30:14,010
joke in my opinion they had a case I

2041
01:30:20,060 --> 01:30:15,800
think but the way it was presented

2042
01:30:23,900 --> 01:30:20,070
trying to claim that the government

2043
01:30:25,670 --> 01:30:23,910
owned the object that was a mistake of

2044
01:30:28,430 --> 01:30:25,680
whoever the lawyer was that was running

2045
01:30:31,910 --> 01:30:28,440
it at the time he who shall not be named

2046
01:30:33,350 --> 01:30:31,920
but but I think they did could have had

2047
01:30:35,510 --> 01:30:33,360
a better case if they'd had a different

2048
01:30:37,070 --> 01:30:35,520
you know different lawyer but so I don't

2049
01:30:40,149 --> 01:30:37,080
know that the case will ever be resolved

2050
01:30:42,919 --> 01:30:40,159
just for what happened my

2051
01:30:46,930 --> 01:30:42,929
feelings right now if that's the way to

2052
01:30:50,209 --> 01:30:46,940
put it is that what they encountered was

2053
01:30:53,029 --> 01:30:50,219
more likely to have been some form of

2054
01:30:55,160 --> 01:30:53,039
test some kind of government test I

2055
01:30:58,100 --> 01:30:55,170
don't have any evidence to back that up

2056
01:31:00,529 --> 01:30:58,110
it's just things that I've heard and my

2057
01:31:01,879 --> 01:31:00,539
impressions based on you know on the

2058
01:31:03,229 --> 01:31:01,889
things that occurred afterwards the

2059
01:31:05,870 --> 01:31:03,239
helicopters coming in around you know

2060
01:31:08,000 --> 01:31:05,880
that sort of thing but that's not proof

2061
01:31:10,430 --> 01:31:08,010
of anything and unfortunately like most

2062
01:31:13,759 --> 01:31:10,440
UFOs it's gone now so there's not much

2063
01:31:17,149 --> 01:31:13,769
we can left to analyze but the remains

2064
01:31:19,069 --> 01:31:17,159
but as far as I know Kurt Collins I mean

2065
01:31:20,600 --> 01:31:19,079
it has always been okay with me so

2066
01:31:22,100 --> 01:31:20,610
unless you know something I don't know

2067
01:31:26,180 --> 01:31:22,110
and I hope people don't say the same

2068
01:31:30,109 --> 01:31:26,190
thing about me so Jan I had a question

2069
01:31:33,169 --> 01:31:30,119
for you on the cash Landrum incident and

2070
01:31:36,049 --> 01:31:33,179
that is I think it's a 2-tiered question

2071
01:31:40,549 --> 01:31:36,059
one is what are your thoughts on it

2072
01:31:43,969 --> 01:31:40,559
in general and do you believe that the

2073
01:31:50,049 --> 01:31:43,979
folks who were possibly exposed to I

2074
01:31:53,270 --> 01:31:50,059
think it's ionizing radiation which was

2075
01:31:56,029 --> 01:31:53,280
suspected by radiologists who actually

2076
01:31:58,759 --> 01:31:56,039
went over the notes that MUFON had on

2077
01:32:00,890 --> 01:31:58,769
this case very carefully do you believe

2078
01:32:03,140 --> 01:32:00,900
that they were exposed to radiation so

2079
01:32:04,939 --> 01:32:03,150
it's two questions what are your

2080
01:32:06,680 --> 01:32:04,949
thoughts on the cash Landrum incident

2081
01:32:09,649 --> 01:32:06,690
and you believe in the possible

2082
01:32:14,379 --> 01:32:09,659
authenticity or validity of these

2083
01:32:19,279 --> 01:32:16,489
it's like Christians saying you know

2084
01:32:24,729 --> 01:32:19,289
it's a it's a UFO we was here and it's

2085
01:32:28,600 --> 01:32:24,739
gone so basically we just have

2086
01:32:31,879 --> 01:32:28,610
afterwards what the story is afterwards

2087
01:32:34,189 --> 01:32:31,889
now I've had radiation too and I don't

2088
01:32:37,160 --> 01:32:34,199
yeah it was not particularly pleasant

2089
01:32:44,239 --> 01:32:37,170
and took me almost a year to recover

2090
01:32:46,069 --> 01:32:44,249
from it because of cancer I think you

2091
01:32:52,160 --> 01:32:46,079
can think of another case right off hand

2092
01:32:58,010 --> 01:32:52,170
in Canada Falken Falken Lake

2093
01:33:02,050 --> 01:32:58,020
the Nicolette case where there is

2094
01:33:05,359 --> 01:33:02,060
extensive medical evidence on that one

2095
01:33:13,090 --> 01:33:05,369
and of course the condom can be more or

2096
01:33:16,729 --> 01:33:13,100
less rope that off and if you talk to

2097
01:33:22,600 --> 01:33:16,739
Chris Rakowski he hadn't written it off

2098
01:33:25,430 --> 01:33:22,610
and his his complete piles will soon be

2099
01:33:31,250 --> 01:33:25,440
available at the University of Manitoba

2100
01:33:35,240 --> 01:33:31,260
so I'm really curious to see all of that

2101
01:33:37,189 --> 01:33:35,250
I have I ever not much on cash Landrum

2102
01:33:44,209 --> 01:33:37,199
but I do have a lot on nickel lock

2103
01:33:47,840 --> 01:33:44,219
Miculek what a what what it is is it's

2104
01:33:50,359 --> 01:33:47,850
it it's once again the the problem that

2105
01:33:55,160 --> 01:33:50,369
we we have the after-effects which I

2106
01:34:02,899 --> 01:33:55,170
think are a way to study UFOs they did

2107
01:34:07,899 --> 01:34:02,909
have After Effects and so there is there

2108
01:34:11,169 --> 01:34:07,909
is an interesting information there I

2109
01:34:15,520 --> 01:34:11,179
have no reason to doubt these people

2110
01:34:19,459 --> 01:34:15,530
maybe Kirk has I don't I don't know but

2111
01:34:22,700 --> 01:34:19,469
I have no reason to doubt him I hadn't

2112
01:34:26,120 --> 01:34:22,710
investigated it that much I think it's a

2113
01:34:30,439 --> 01:34:26,130
it's a it's an interesting case and if

2114
01:34:33,740 --> 01:34:30,449
there were a scientific investigation it

2115
01:34:36,830 --> 01:34:33,750
should be looked at well I just had jump

2116
01:34:39,020 --> 01:34:36,840
in really quick here the case said did

2117
01:34:42,260 --> 01:34:39,030
they get back into the news because I

2118
01:34:43,790 --> 01:34:42,270
apparently the a tip program Commission

2119
01:34:48,590 --> 01:34:43,800
one of the papers that they commissioned

2120
01:34:51,050 --> 01:34:48,600
was to kid green and it was regarding

2121
01:34:54,649 --> 01:34:51,060
the physical effects of relatively close

2122
01:34:56,060 --> 01:34:54,659
UFO contact and that paper was released

2123
01:34:58,250 --> 01:34:56,070
were able to be through it it

2124
01:34:59,810 --> 01:34:58,260
prominently mentioned cash Landrum II

2125
01:35:03,589 --> 01:34:59,820
didn't go into a lot of details and

2126
01:35:05,220 --> 01:35:03,599
cited a lot of outside research work

2127
01:35:07,729 --> 01:35:05,230
regarding

2128
01:35:10,770 --> 01:35:07,739
exposure and so on and so forth but

2129
01:35:13,800 --> 01:35:10,780
really quick Christian apparently

2130
01:35:16,410 --> 01:35:13,810
Schussler and green that did do some

2131
01:35:17,790 --> 01:35:16,420
work on this particular case and that

2132
01:35:22,130 --> 01:35:17,800
can you tell us a little bit about that

2133
01:35:28,770 --> 01:35:24,780
not specifically about the work that

2134
01:35:31,410 --> 01:35:28,780
Schuster and Green had done and one of

2135
01:35:34,530 --> 01:35:31,420
the reasons that and I don't have at

2136
01:35:36,750 --> 01:35:34,540
this point any direct reason to fault

2137
01:35:37,590 --> 01:35:36,760
John Schuessler or his team for doing

2138
01:35:40,050 --> 01:35:37,600
anything I mean they were working

2139
01:35:42,420 --> 01:35:40,060
independently and working with through

2140
01:35:45,270 --> 01:35:42,430
MUFON and Tom and I were trying to just

2141
01:35:50,720 --> 01:35:45,280
do our own kind of cursory or initial

2142
01:35:57,780 --> 01:35:55,100
ended up kind of just letting it go was

2143
01:36:00,840 --> 01:35:57,790
and through no fault of their own but by

2144
01:36:02,280 --> 01:36:00,850
that time of course Vickie Landrum who

2145
01:36:05,520 --> 01:36:02,290
was still here in Texas so I could at

2146
01:36:11,220 --> 01:36:05,530
least drive down there talk to her was

2147
01:36:13,380 --> 01:36:11,230
so beholden to John that some of the

2148
01:36:15,930 --> 01:36:13,390
things that I had asked we might have

2149
01:36:17,880 --> 01:36:15,940
wanted to try to do or had tried may

2150
01:36:20,880 --> 01:36:17,890
have thought of doing she's like well I

2151
01:36:23,100 --> 01:36:20,890
don't know I need to check with John and

2152
01:36:24,780 --> 01:36:23,110
at that point I realized well anything

2153
01:36:26,580 --> 01:36:24,790
that we might want to do or pursue or

2154
01:36:29,540 --> 01:36:26,590
any investigation we might per take that

2155
01:36:31,770 --> 01:36:29,550
we needed to discuss with her was

2156
01:36:33,450 --> 01:36:31,780
probably they're gonna get you know so

2157
01:36:36,240 --> 01:36:33,460
go straight to back to John to begin

2158
01:36:41,220 --> 01:36:36,250
with and it simply meant we did not have

2159
01:36:43,050 --> 01:36:41,230
as free personal access to her as I

2160
01:36:44,280 --> 01:36:43,060
might have liked and and I don't blame

2161
01:36:46,590 --> 01:36:44,290
her for that at all I can certainly

2162
01:36:48,810 --> 01:36:46,600
understand it sounds like John must have

2163
01:36:50,370 --> 01:36:48,820
been there for them when they needed it

2164
01:36:52,410 --> 01:36:50,380
and help them in enough ways that she

2165
01:36:54,060 --> 01:36:52,420
was obviously going to had a lot of

2166
01:36:59,720 --> 01:36:54,070
respect for John and more power to him

2167
01:37:02,490 --> 01:36:59,730
for that but what John and KITT green

2168
01:37:05,070 --> 01:37:02,500
boy I don't know when you bring up KITT

2169
01:37:08,340 --> 01:37:05,080
Green itself I mentioned a chant that in

2170
01:37:10,770 --> 01:37:08,350
the last two days I sat down a few days

2171
01:37:16,770 --> 01:37:10,780
I sat down and went completely back

2172
01:37:19,020 --> 01:37:16,780
through valleys volume two and three and

2173
01:37:22,200 --> 01:37:19,030
in part it was simply because you

2174
01:37:24,750 --> 01:37:22,210
I began to think wait a minute

2175
01:37:26,399 --> 01:37:24,760
yo weirdest kid because no matter where

2176
01:37:30,660 --> 01:37:26,409
you look if you look at it closely

2177
01:37:31,169 --> 01:37:30,670
enough kick greens there I mean in some

2178
01:37:33,419 --> 01:37:31,179
way

2179
01:37:35,069 --> 01:37:33,429
he's the little guy in the crowd of the

2180
01:37:37,229 --> 01:37:35,079
people and nobody realizes but who's in

2181
01:37:39,600 --> 01:37:37,239
charge it's that guy right there in the

2182
01:37:41,459 --> 01:37:39,610
back that nobody seems to really know

2183
01:37:43,649 --> 01:37:41,469
who he is or what he's doing but if you

2184
01:37:47,580 --> 01:37:43,659
go black you realize kid green has been

2185
01:37:50,520 --> 01:37:47,590
into this entire gamut of everything

2186
01:37:52,850 --> 01:37:50,530
we've been talking about since almost as

2187
01:37:55,890 --> 01:37:52,860
far since I was in college practically

2188
01:37:59,069 --> 01:37:55,900
and so no doubt he's had obviously

2189
01:38:00,839 --> 01:37:59,079
affiliations with John and when you go

2190
01:38:04,260 --> 01:38:00,849
looking at how bass bought into the me

2191
01:38:06,899 --> 01:38:04,270
fond database who did they go to to

2192
01:38:08,220 --> 01:38:06,909
effectively work you know on that on the

2193
01:38:11,129 --> 01:38:08,230
mute Fania well they went to John

2194
01:38:13,260 --> 01:38:11,139
Schuessler and not to say they're not

2195
01:38:16,919 --> 01:38:13,270
qualified people with just unfortunately

2196
01:38:18,959 --> 01:38:16,929
that's a that's a database we're not

2197
01:38:20,310 --> 01:38:18,969
going to readily tap we're not gonna

2198
01:38:22,140 --> 01:38:20,320
have access to whatever they're doing

2199
01:38:24,270 --> 01:38:22,150
behind the scenes that that they're

2200
01:38:26,700 --> 01:38:24,280
doing and that's a shame I think that's

2201
01:38:29,100 --> 01:38:26,710
a shame I mean more credit to Jann and

2202
01:38:30,479 --> 01:38:29,110
his friends and Brad and Jim and all of

2203
01:38:32,129 --> 01:38:30,489
you guys who are putting the information

2204
01:38:35,120 --> 01:38:32,139
together at least where it will be out

2205
01:38:37,500 --> 01:38:35,130
there for people to get access to it

2206
01:38:39,600 --> 01:38:37,510
once if it's a black hole it doesn't no

2207
01:38:41,520 --> 01:38:39,610
one any good except the people who

2208
01:38:43,890 --> 01:38:41,530
apparently don't want us to pay too much

2209
01:38:45,270 --> 01:38:43,900
attention to what they're doing but I

2210
01:38:46,830 --> 01:38:45,280
don't know that's my I have my own

2211
01:38:48,240 --> 01:38:46,840
opinions but I don't want to speak ill

2212
01:38:49,919 --> 01:38:48,250
of anybody who if I don't have a

2213
01:38:52,500 --> 01:38:49,929
specific reason to but I have

2214
01:38:54,689 --> 01:38:52,510
frustrations like all of us knew well

2215
01:38:57,870 --> 01:38:54,699
apparently what happened if you know I'm

2216
01:39:00,060 --> 01:38:57,880
reading greens report to basically bass

2217
01:39:03,000 --> 01:39:00,070
which apparently went over to a tip

2218
01:39:04,709 --> 01:39:03,010
eventually was he was brought in and he

2219
01:39:08,790 --> 01:39:04,719
must have done some kind of medical

2220
01:39:11,399 --> 01:39:08,800
examination some kind of tests on cash

2221
01:39:13,319 --> 01:39:11,409
and Landrum because the sighting he I

2222
01:39:15,720 --> 01:39:13,329
can't go into too much detail in this

2223
01:39:17,760 --> 01:39:15,730
report about what I found out from that

2224
01:39:20,850 --> 01:39:17,770
particular case because of HIPAA

2225
01:39:22,859 --> 01:39:20,860
compliance so he must have been involved

2226
01:39:25,500 --> 01:39:22,869
medically Schuessler must have got it

2227
01:39:28,919 --> 01:39:25,510
and gotten him involved medically at

2228
01:39:30,359 --> 01:39:28,929
some point in that in all this least

2229
01:39:32,970 --> 01:39:30,369
that's the assumption again my own

2230
01:39:33,990 --> 01:39:32,980
experience report yeah my I would

2231
01:39:37,110 --> 01:39:34,000
I would tend to agree with that

2232
01:39:39,750 --> 01:39:37,120
assumption and I would say one of those

2233
01:39:43,290 --> 01:39:39,760
$20 bets that if you go back and look

2234
01:39:45,600 --> 01:39:43,300
behind the scenes of all almost all of

2235
01:39:46,950 --> 01:39:45,610
these medical cases or medical

2236
01:39:47,250 --> 01:39:46,960
information or whatever you want to call

2237
01:39:52,500 --> 01:39:47,260
it

2238
01:39:54,930 --> 01:39:52,510
green mean to him somewhere he'll get

2239
01:39:58,080 --> 01:39:54,940
access to it no different than the the

2240
01:40:00,180 --> 01:39:58,090
guys who supposedly had MRIs done out at

2241
01:40:03,540 --> 01:40:00,190
skinwalker ranch you know I'm pretty

2242
01:40:06,930 --> 01:40:03,550
sure somewhere that folder ends up with

2243
01:40:08,790 --> 01:40:06,940
KITT green there is a there is some

2244
01:40:11,340 --> 01:40:08,800
irony in all this because that green is

2245
01:40:13,140 --> 01:40:11,350
basically telling a pentagon program I

2246
01:40:16,500 --> 01:40:13,150
can't tell you I can't tell you

2247
01:40:18,630 --> 01:40:16,510
something in the report I will I will

2248
01:40:21,380 --> 01:40:18,640
mention one thing because I've been told

2249
01:40:26,370 --> 01:40:21,390
this would be worth mentioning just

2250
01:40:29,220 --> 01:40:26,380
because of the implications that as far

2251
01:40:31,950 --> 01:40:29,230
back as even when knids was involved in

2252
01:40:33,600 --> 01:40:31,960
the cattle mutilations i'm the

2253
01:40:34,830 --> 01:40:33,610
investigation and even the mutilations

2254
01:40:36,720 --> 01:40:34,840
all throughout the seventies or tom

2255
01:40:40,440 --> 01:40:36,730
adams and gary massey and a lot of that

2256
01:40:44,040 --> 01:40:40,450
going on that which was really a

2257
01:40:45,870 --> 01:40:44,050
surprise to me the two have valet come

2258
01:40:47,640 --> 01:40:45,880
right out and say if any of you are

2259
01:40:48,810 --> 01:40:47,650
aware of the cattle mutilation scenario

2260
01:40:50,880 --> 01:40:48,820
that went all the way you back when the

2261
01:40:53,520 --> 01:40:50,890
FBI and the CBI Colorado Bureau of

2262
01:40:56,160 --> 01:40:53,530
Investigation was involved and a guy by

2263
01:40:58,500 --> 01:40:56,170
the name of Kenneth Rommel who was

2264
01:41:00,750 --> 01:40:58,510
supposedly the person who was running

2265
01:41:05,360 --> 01:41:00,760
the investigation on behalf of these

2266
01:41:09,090 --> 01:41:05,370
authorities that to see it printed by

2267
01:41:10,620 --> 01:41:09,100
Jacques Vallee and some other

2268
01:41:11,970 --> 01:41:10,630
information I wish I could share but

2269
01:41:15,450 --> 01:41:11,980
I'll just have to leave it which

2270
01:41:18,479 --> 01:41:15,460
suddenly substantiates that that it was

2271
01:41:23,460 --> 01:41:18,489
KITT green with the CIA who hired

2272
01:41:26,040 --> 01:41:23,470
Kenneth Rommel I'm like what this is

2273
01:41:27,780 --> 01:41:26,050
supposedly Kenneth Rommel who comes in

2274
01:41:30,360 --> 01:41:27,790
and kind of from what people would say

2275
01:41:33,060 --> 01:41:30,370
did what the condom committee did to the

2276
01:41:35,550 --> 01:41:33,070
UFO phenomenon I just bring him in and

2277
01:41:37,200 --> 01:41:35,560
then they squash it and apparently

2278
01:41:40,410 --> 01:41:37,210
though it was a surprise to me because

2279
01:41:42,300 --> 01:41:40,420
I've heard from way back you know of the

2280
01:41:44,310 --> 01:41:42,310
situation when Kenneth Rommel was trying

2281
01:41:45,840 --> 01:41:44,320
to make everybody think it's predators

2282
01:41:46,900 --> 01:41:45,850
or downplaying the whole thing but then

2283
01:41:50,020 --> 01:41:46,910
to find out that

2284
01:41:54,190 --> 01:41:50,030
kick green at the CIE are the ones who

2285
01:41:56,260 --> 01:41:54,200
brought Rommel in but it was not told

2286
01:41:57,790 --> 01:41:56,270
that way I wonder whether the FBI or

2287
01:41:59,620 --> 01:41:57,800
even the Senators Hirsch and Schmitt

2288
01:42:04,030 --> 01:41:59,630
these these people who thought it was an

2289
01:42:05,860 --> 01:42:04,040
independent invest at something I'll

2290
01:42:08,050 --> 01:42:05,870
have to think long and hard about but

2291
01:42:11,290 --> 01:42:08,060
valet wrote about it he stated it in his

2292
01:42:15,580 --> 01:42:11,300
own books and I'd like that's they were

2293
01:42:18,010 --> 01:42:15,590
buddies Harrison Schmitt just jumping in

2294
01:42:20,470 --> 01:42:18,020
with a little bit of background was one

2295
01:42:23,110 --> 01:42:20,480
of the moonwalkers I was on I think at

2296
01:42:26,350 --> 01:42:23,120
fifteen or sixteen maybe and then was

2297
01:42:28,330 --> 01:42:26,360
later elected to the US Senate yeah so

2298
01:42:30,790 --> 01:42:28,340
well there you go these are people who I

2299
01:42:32,860 --> 01:42:30,800
wonder whether they were aware that

2300
01:42:37,320 --> 01:42:32,870
Kenneth Rommel was apparently brought in

2301
01:42:41,770 --> 01:42:39,340
investigate who were looking for someone

2302
01:42:43,090 --> 01:42:41,780
to be an independent arbiter it just

2303
01:42:45,490 --> 01:42:43,100
surprised me to think that but once

2304
01:42:47,980 --> 01:42:45,500
again you know even valet didn't quite

2305
01:42:50,200 --> 01:42:47,990
know what to think a lot of the things

2306
01:42:51,580 --> 01:42:50,210
that were happening that maybe he knew

2307
01:42:55,720 --> 01:42:51,590
everything maybe he didn't but these

2308
01:42:59,320 --> 01:42:55,730
people in particular kit Green has been

2309
01:43:02,470 --> 01:42:59,330
right at the middle of everything all

2310
01:43:05,650 --> 01:43:02,480
the way back that's why my take on it if

2311
01:43:08,440 --> 01:43:05,660
you go back now and you look at bass and

2312
01:43:10,000 --> 01:43:08,450
a tip we talked about this before I

2313
01:43:13,960 --> 01:43:10,010
think you know but you're gonna find

2314
01:43:17,410 --> 01:43:13,970
that the same small group of maybe four

2315
01:43:19,510 --> 01:43:17,420
people I'm winging off I can think of

2316
01:43:21,640 --> 01:43:19,520
one two three four five ever since and

2317
01:43:23,560 --> 01:43:21,650
ID's all the way up through to probably

2318
01:43:27,250 --> 01:43:23,570
to the stars well you've got that green

2319
01:43:29,200 --> 01:43:27,260
in valet who else actually

2320
01:43:33,010 --> 01:43:29,210
I don't necessarily think I would

2321
01:43:35,170 --> 01:43:33,020
include valet as one yes he I believe he

2322
01:43:37,000 --> 01:43:35,180
built the database for bass he obviously

2323
01:43:40,750 --> 01:43:37,010
was asked it's interesting

2324
01:43:42,880 --> 01:43:40,760
it sounds like Bob Bigelow initially

2325
01:43:46,030 --> 01:43:42,890
wanted valet to be the director of mids

2326
01:43:48,340 --> 01:43:46,040
and for whatever reasons of his own

2327
01:43:50,170 --> 01:43:48,350
valet decided he didn't want to be the

2328
01:43:53,140 --> 01:43:50,180
director he would rather but he'd be on

2329
01:43:56,320 --> 01:43:53,150
the board of Advisory Board and the next

2330
01:43:59,560 --> 01:43:56,330
thing you know kick greens going to be

2331
01:44:00,970 --> 01:43:59,570
the chair and from what I've been told

2332
01:44:04,360 --> 01:44:00,980
kick green and John Allen

2333
01:44:07,060 --> 01:44:04,370
Xander probably I not sure of this but I

2334
01:44:09,340 --> 01:44:07,070
think perhaps John Alexander had a hand

2335
01:44:11,350 --> 01:44:09,350
in and introducing kick green as far as

2336
01:44:15,160 --> 01:44:11,360
to Bob Bigelow goes but I think from

2337
01:44:19,570 --> 01:44:15,170
that point on you'd find kick green how

2338
01:44:22,300 --> 01:44:19,580
put off you know and in fact I get to

2339
01:44:24,580 --> 01:44:22,310
that point John Alexander who at least

2340
01:44:27,190 --> 01:44:24,590
was certainly one of the early guys in

2341
01:44:28,990 --> 01:44:27,200
there but I think there's a somewhere in

2342
01:44:32,020 --> 01:44:29,000
the kick green how put off thing that

2343
01:44:34,570 --> 01:44:32,030
has been behind all of this and it seems

2344
01:44:36,250 --> 01:44:34,580
that it always seems to percolate around

2345
01:44:38,800 --> 01:44:36,260
somebody who brings in a source of

2346
01:44:42,310 --> 01:44:38,810
funding either it's Bigelow or it's

2347
01:44:44,890 --> 01:44:42,320
Harry Reid or whomever but for whatever

2348
01:44:48,190 --> 01:44:44,900
reason Green's name never appears above

2349
01:44:49,000 --> 01:44:48,200
the line you'll see he's not listed he

2350
01:44:51,330 --> 01:44:49,010
writes the Kryta

2351
01:44:53,890 --> 01:44:51,340
or excuse me he writes one to the dir DS

2352
01:44:56,260 --> 01:44:53,900
but interestingly enough that's that's

2353
01:44:58,510 --> 01:44:56,270
the only one that didn't get put on the

2354
01:45:00,340 --> 01:44:58,520
congressional reading list I don't

2355
01:45:02,380 --> 01:45:00,350
really know why that one would be left

2356
01:45:04,750 --> 01:45:02,390
off but of all the other ones and I

2357
01:45:06,400 --> 01:45:04,760
think even I'm not mistaken it's been

2358
01:45:10,060 --> 01:45:06,410
rented written about online already by

2359
01:45:11,979 --> 01:45:10,070
now that of all those other dir DS that

2360
01:45:13,870 --> 01:45:11,989
were paid for right with taxpayer

2361
01:45:16,510 --> 01:45:13,880
dollars that were then put on the

2362
01:45:22,390 --> 01:45:16,520
congressional reading list a story I've

2363
01:45:24,010 --> 01:45:22,400
heard is greens was left off maybe

2364
01:45:26,860 --> 01:45:24,020
because it made too much a direct

2365
01:45:28,930 --> 01:45:26,870
reference to you ApS or whatnot but

2366
01:45:34,090 --> 01:45:28,940
that's interesting as well

2367
01:45:35,740 --> 01:45:34,100
coincidental maybe but I don't know I've

2368
01:45:38,650 --> 01:45:35,750
only seen interviews with these guys and

2369
01:45:41,110 --> 01:45:38,660
to be honest with you they seemed like

2370
01:45:43,510 --> 01:45:41,120
likeable people they really do and if

2371
01:45:46,420 --> 01:45:43,520
they're doing serious research more

2372
01:45:48,250 --> 01:45:46,430
power to them but it's the idea of so

2373
01:45:49,240 --> 01:45:48,260
many things that apparently cannot be

2374
01:45:51,430 --> 01:45:49,250
talked about aren't going to be

2375
01:45:53,979 --> 01:45:51,440
discussed we're told to invest money

2376
01:45:57,729 --> 01:45:53,989
they're on stage they're playing to us

2377
01:45:59,800 --> 01:45:57,739
as their audience but then the stories

2378
01:46:01,210 --> 01:45:59,810
begin to change or some things don't fit

2379
01:46:03,070 --> 01:46:01,220
and when you ask a direct question they

2380
01:46:07,720 --> 01:46:03,080
don't tell you and you can't be told

2381
01:46:08,800 --> 01:46:07,730
that and I don't know it it makes me

2382
01:46:10,630 --> 01:46:08,810
uncomfortable what to think

2383
01:46:11,830 --> 01:46:10,640
but then again maybe I'm not any

2384
01:46:14,470 --> 01:46:11,840
different than Jacques Vallee over the

2385
01:46:19,010 --> 01:46:14,480
last 40 years that he's writing books

2386
01:46:24,439 --> 01:46:19,020
[Laughter]

2387
01:46:26,050 --> 01:46:24,449
amen brother I think that if we really

2388
01:46:29,209 --> 01:46:26,060
want to look at the people that are

2389
01:46:34,510 --> 01:46:29,219
hiding things there's a there's a quite

2390
01:46:41,630 --> 01:46:38,930
are quite frankly not being candid with

2391
01:46:48,020 --> 01:46:41,640
us I agree I agree

2392
01:46:50,180 --> 01:46:48,030
IIIi did read the paper you were talking

2393
01:46:54,530 --> 01:46:50,190
about and it talks about the Brazilian

2394
01:46:57,620 --> 01:46:54,540
thing is trying to get some translation

2395
01:47:01,070 --> 01:46:57,630
work done on this now with the Brazilian

2396
01:47:03,350 --> 01:47:01,080
thing is it's like this oh we've lost

2397
01:47:05,330 --> 01:47:03,360
some of the government papers and then

2398
01:47:07,880 --> 01:47:05,340
somebody else over here says oh I've got

2399
01:47:10,820 --> 01:47:07,890
them give me $2,000 then I'll translate

2400
01:47:13,729 --> 01:47:10,830
them and then somebody over here says oh

2401
01:47:15,500 --> 01:47:13,739
I got him just it's just $4,000 we'll

2402
01:47:20,030 --> 01:47:15,510
translate them into English for you I'm

2403
01:47:25,990 --> 01:47:20,040
saying okay let's let's not do that I I

2404
01:47:28,870 --> 01:47:26,000
did we did find it at Mary's house

2405
01:47:34,610 --> 01:47:28,880
apparently somebody in Brazil

2406
01:47:40,130 --> 01:47:34,620
contemporary with operation plate did

2407
01:47:43,910 --> 01:47:40,140
send Hynek some material on that now

2408
01:47:50,300 --> 01:47:43,920
it's very it's very sparse but it's got

2409
01:47:51,850 --> 01:47:50,310
a lot of photographs and this guy said

2410
01:47:54,530 --> 01:47:51,860
well these aren't supposed to be

2411
01:48:00,830 --> 01:47:54,540
circulated so it's not it's another one

2412
01:48:04,910 --> 01:48:00,840
of those things but it's an interesting

2413
01:48:07,280 --> 01:48:04,920
thing about the operation plate how you

2414
01:48:10,729 --> 01:48:07,290
know since you know everything you

2415
01:48:16,610 --> 01:48:10,739
cannot it's the closer you get the

2416
01:48:21,320 --> 01:48:16,620
farther everything goes away but it is

2417
01:48:23,890 --> 01:48:21,330
interesting and we as a matter of fact

2418
01:48:26,150 --> 01:48:23,900
we are working on Bruce Brazil right now

2419
01:48:28,320 --> 01:48:26,160
with that which Brazil case do you mean

2420
01:48:31,810 --> 01:48:28,330
yet there's a few of

2421
01:48:35,740 --> 01:48:31,820
we're talking about the operation plate

2422
01:48:39,910 --> 01:48:35,750
okay okay where the what what happened

2423
01:48:42,340 --> 01:48:39,920
is people were reporting that they had

2424
01:48:46,110 --> 01:48:42,350
been assaulted by essentially that's

2425
01:48:48,630 --> 01:48:46,120
what it is assaulted by UFOs and the

2426
01:48:53,190 --> 01:48:48,640
Polaris case er is at a different case

2427
01:48:58,870 --> 01:48:53,200
it's it's a whole whole series of cases

2428
01:49:02,640 --> 01:48:58,880
and and the the Brazil the they

2429
01:49:09,190 --> 01:49:02,650
dispatches Colonel up there to

2430
01:49:12,400 --> 01:49:09,200
investigate it with his team and then

2431
01:49:16,690 --> 01:49:12,410
from whatever happened it appears that

2432
01:49:19,540 --> 01:49:16,700
some of the materials lost some of the

2433
01:49:27,640 --> 01:49:19,550
material fell into various ufologists

2434
01:49:28,990 --> 01:49:27,650
hands and even Hynek had some and of

2435
01:49:31,660 --> 01:49:29,000
course we haven't you know we haven't

2436
01:49:35,200 --> 01:49:31,670
got Hynek stuff translated it's it's

2437
01:49:37,630 --> 01:49:35,210
very like I say it's very sparse I

2438
01:49:39,940 --> 01:49:37,640
talked to Tom to lean and he said that I

2439
01:49:42,880 --> 01:49:39,950
don't recall the man's name but he he's

2440
01:49:44,890 --> 01:49:42,890
passed away but Tom tahleen said oh yeah

2441
01:49:49,390 --> 01:49:44,900
he's highly respected in Brazil he's

2442
01:49:51,900 --> 01:49:49,400
he's one of the he's one of the one of

2443
01:49:56,440 --> 01:49:51,910
the better ufologist in Brazil so

2444
01:49:59,230 --> 01:49:56,450
anything he sent Hynek there's probably

2445
01:50:01,870 --> 01:49:59,240
pretty good stuff now Willie Smith

2446
01:50:08,110 --> 01:50:01,880
didn't have hardly anything on an

2447
01:50:13,830 --> 01:50:08,120
operation plate and I mean he's had all

2448
01:50:18,100 --> 01:50:17,170
had all kinds of it's almost like they

2449
01:50:22,300 --> 01:50:18,110
were assaulted

2450
01:50:24,130 --> 01:50:22,310
I mean beat up or something yeah just up

2451
01:50:26,590 --> 01:50:24,140
for a little background yeah that is the

2452
01:50:32,320 --> 01:50:26,600
same case are you talking about Guevara

2453
01:50:34,570 --> 01:50:32,330
as the ufologist AJ guimard no he and I

2454
01:50:36,640 --> 01:50:34,580
had some contact okay

2455
01:50:38,890 --> 01:50:36,650
okay cuz I know he is involved but that

2456
01:50:40,360 --> 01:50:38,900
yeah solved and yet here too

2457
01:50:44,040 --> 01:50:40,370
stuff that we were going to we were

2458
01:50:51,550 --> 01:50:48,730
translated but there's there's something

2459
01:50:54,790 --> 01:50:51,560
with the Brazilian tax thing if we could

2460
01:50:56,800 --> 01:50:54,800
you know how how we get him the money he

2461
01:50:59,200 --> 01:50:56,810
would not have to pay as much income tax

2462
01:51:04,090 --> 01:50:59,210
one way or another and so it kind of

2463
01:51:06,340 --> 01:51:04,100
broke down on that and he you know he

2464
01:51:08,200 --> 01:51:06,350
didn't he didn't want a lot of money he

2465
01:51:13,510 --> 01:51:08,210
just wanted enough to cover his expenses

2466
01:51:15,370 --> 01:51:13,520
and the translators expense but I guess

2467
01:51:18,010 --> 01:51:15,380
Brazil if money comes in from the

2468
01:51:20,470 --> 01:51:18,020
outside they tax it to the Eberly got it

2469
01:51:23,320 --> 01:51:20,480
got it but yeah that is a Jana's talking

2470
01:51:27,160 --> 01:51:23,330
about the Clara's case operation saucer

2471
01:51:30,130 --> 01:51:27,170
or operation plate operatio pronto and

2472
01:51:33,610 --> 01:51:30,140
Portuguese and yeah that was a case

2473
01:51:36,490 --> 01:51:33,620
where actually the captain who commanded

2474
01:51:38,650 --> 01:51:36,500
the the the group that went out to

2475
01:51:40,930 --> 01:51:38,660
culeros sets the closer look actually

2476
01:51:44,530 --> 01:51:40,940
ultimately committed suicide

2477
01:51:47,500 --> 01:51:44,540
unfortunately and let's see according to

2478
01:51:49,540 --> 01:51:47,510
a ufologist Joc Bolle a number of

2479
01:51:51,550 --> 01:51:49,550
individuals were reportedly killed as a

2480
01:51:54,010 --> 01:51:51,560
result of the lights fired upon them by

2481
01:51:56,320 --> 01:51:54,020
the UFOs injuries were consistent with

2482
01:51:58,600 --> 01:51:56,330
the radiation effects from microwaves

2483
01:52:01,390 --> 01:51:58,610
other ufologist claimed the lights from

2484
01:52:06,340 --> 01:52:01,400
UFOs sucked blood from 400 people so

2485
01:52:07,690 --> 01:52:06,350
yeah that's a big case and I and I do

2486
01:52:11,730 --> 01:52:07,700
know that that Bigelow was that

2487
01:52:19,870 --> 01:52:16,450
it's really and I think tick green did

2488
01:52:21,760 --> 01:52:19,880
mention it in his papers I wasn't too

2489
01:52:25,590 --> 01:52:21,770
impressed by his paper but that you know

2490
01:52:29,170 --> 01:52:25,600
it's yeah well yeah I mean basically

2491
01:52:33,130 --> 01:52:29,180
it's a typical scientific paper he gives

2492
01:52:36,010 --> 01:52:33,140
the results and as far as going back and

2493
01:52:39,340 --> 01:52:36,020
checking things which you have to do in

2494
01:52:43,870 --> 01:52:39,350
ufology yeah everybody's offering their

2495
01:52:46,300 --> 01:52:43,880
theories and their results but seldom

2496
01:52:49,710 --> 01:52:46,310
you know we can we check these things

2497
01:52:54,620 --> 01:52:49,720
out that's a that's a big problem with

2498
01:53:07,230 --> 01:53:03,780
the whole apology supposed baby keys and

2499
01:53:13,320 --> 01:53:07,240
all this other stuff really get that

2500
01:53:16,650 --> 01:53:13,330
that goes all the way back to beans and

2501
01:53:22,530 --> 01:53:16,660
everything so it's been going on forever

2502
01:53:24,300 --> 01:53:22,540
in ethology so we've got a lot of really

2503
01:53:28,710 --> 01:53:24,310
don't care who you are I don't care who

2504
01:53:32,070 --> 01:53:28,720
you are I think we need to really

2505
01:53:47,490 --> 01:53:32,080
anybody that's got something looks

2506
01:53:50,040 --> 01:53:47,500
abstain as well slides are not the first

2507
01:53:52,920 --> 01:53:50,050
time that this happened oh I know yeah

2508
01:53:57,150 --> 01:53:52,930
this goes all the way back to 79 the

2509
01:53:58,860 --> 01:53:57,160
baby the skeleton of the big people

2510
01:54:00,360 --> 01:53:58,870
needed to do their due diligence when

2511
01:54:02,730 --> 01:54:00,370
they do research and they shouldn't rely

2512
01:54:04,650 --> 01:54:02,740
on others and just assume they're right

2513
01:54:13,650 --> 01:54:04,660
they need to actually do research on it

2514
01:54:15,030 --> 01:54:13,660
no matter that cash Landrum case said

2515
01:54:17,820 --> 01:54:15,040
that I actually wanted to ask a

2516
01:54:22,170 --> 01:54:17,830
Christian and Jan and that is cash and

2517
01:54:25,170 --> 01:54:22,180
Landrum if they were actually exposed to

2518
01:54:28,350 --> 01:54:25,180
a government related project as

2519
01:54:31,770 --> 01:54:28,360
Christian postulated earlier in the show

2520
01:54:33,150 --> 01:54:31,780
I wanted to ask you about that topic but

2521
01:54:36,300 --> 01:54:33,160
I wanted to preface it with some

2522
01:54:39,600 --> 01:54:36,310
interesting information area 51 has had

2523
01:54:43,800 --> 01:54:39,610
some interesting lawsuits related to

2524
01:54:45,330 --> 01:54:43,810
environmental toxin exposure by multiple

2525
01:54:48,360 --> 01:54:45,340
workers who have dedicated their lives

2526
01:54:50,970 --> 01:54:48,370
to working over there and they brought

2527
01:54:53,900 --> 01:54:50,980
lawsuits against the US government and

2528
01:54:57,930 --> 01:54:53,910
the US government's response were

2529
01:54:59,430 --> 01:54:57,940
basically interesting a one is President

2530
01:55:01,950 --> 01:54:59,440
Clinton invoked the military and state

2531
01:55:03,750 --> 01:55:01,960
secrets privilege specifically exempting

2532
01:55:07,110 --> 01:55:03,760
the base from disclosing any pollution

2533
01:55:09,300 --> 01:55:07,120
reports at all and the government's

2534
01:55:14,700 --> 01:55:09,310
response also was interesting in the

2535
01:55:16,920 --> 01:55:14,710
fact that they actually try to just not

2536
01:55:19,590 --> 01:55:16,930
say anything like have any statement

2537
01:55:21,030 --> 01:55:19,600
whatsoever but I think one of the

2538
01:55:23,340 --> 01:55:21,040
statements they said here let me see if

2539
01:55:26,370 --> 01:55:23,350
I can bring that up as a Washington Post

2540
01:55:28,740 --> 01:55:26,380
inquired of the Air Force about this

2541
01:55:30,960 --> 01:55:28,750
topic and they said that the Air Force

2542
01:55:33,420 --> 01:55:30,970
touts its strong environmental record

2543
01:55:36,660 --> 01:55:33,430
and the spokesman refused to address any

2544
01:55:37,800 --> 01:55:36,670
questions about area 51 and most people

2545
01:55:39,240 --> 01:55:37,810
understand that there is some

2546
01:55:41,490 --> 01:55:39,250
information the government has to keep

2547
01:55:43,800 --> 01:55:41,500
secret to protect national security in

2548
01:55:45,300 --> 01:55:43,810
the military personnel to keep us all

2549
01:55:49,740 --> 01:55:45,310
safe the statement said now my question

2550
01:55:52,560 --> 01:55:49,750
here is if cash and Landrum a folks were

2551
01:55:54,600 --> 01:55:52,570
actually exposed to real radiation by

2552
01:55:58,710 --> 01:55:54,610
the US government due to a top-secret

2553
01:56:00,870 --> 01:55:58,720
project how how effective do you think

2554
01:56:04,860 --> 01:56:00,880
they would be in actually having their

2555
01:56:07,320 --> 01:56:04,870
lawsuit result in some kind of wind for

2556
01:56:11,550 --> 01:56:07,330
them if it was top-secret late related

2557
01:56:13,470 --> 01:56:11,560
or classified I have thought a little

2558
01:56:15,000 --> 01:56:13,480
bit about that and of course I am NOT an

2559
01:56:17,670 --> 01:56:15,010
attorney so I'm sure there are

2560
01:56:20,580 --> 01:56:17,680
complications that I might not think of

2561
01:56:23,630 --> 01:56:20,590
but I do recall reading about their case

2562
01:56:28,350 --> 01:56:23,640
when they did go to court they had a

2563
01:56:30,510 --> 01:56:28,360
local attorney and then I believe it was

2564
01:56:33,690 --> 01:56:30,520
Peter Gersten who decided he would get

2565
01:56:35,700 --> 01:56:33,700
in and help represent them and for

2566
01:56:37,770 --> 01:56:35,710
whatever reason and I may be

2567
01:56:39,630 --> 01:56:37,780
paraphrasing some of this but the take

2568
01:56:45,720 --> 01:56:39,640
that they tried to the approach that

2569
01:56:48,420 --> 01:56:45,730
they tried to take seemed to be that the

2570
01:56:49,260 --> 01:56:48,430
government somehow controlled which is

2571
01:56:50,490 --> 01:56:49,270
going to kind of what you were

2572
01:56:53,220 --> 01:56:50,500
describing the government somehow

2573
01:56:58,530 --> 01:56:53,230
controlled or had control over this

2574
01:57:00,600 --> 01:56:58,540
object and therefore pay up they were

2575
01:57:03,479 --> 01:57:00,610
injured somehow it blame it on the

2576
01:57:05,040 --> 01:57:03,489
government unfortunately as I think

2577
01:57:07,140 --> 01:57:05,050
would have been clear to anyone it

2578
01:57:10,470 --> 01:57:07,150
seemed clear to me they had no evidence

2579
01:57:13,020 --> 01:57:10,480
to support that they had nothing to show

2580
01:57:14,940 --> 01:57:13,030
that as a claim that they could take to

2581
01:57:16,979 --> 01:57:14,950
court and the judge or somebody is gonna

2582
01:57:19,500 --> 01:57:16,989
say well where's your proof

2583
01:57:21,509 --> 01:57:19,510
I would have approached it differently I

2584
01:57:24,200 --> 01:57:21,519
would have approached it as either

2585
01:57:28,529 --> 01:57:24,210
negligence whether it was a government

2586
01:57:31,169 --> 01:57:28,539
experiment or a quote-unquote UFO or

2587
01:57:32,640 --> 01:57:31,179
whatever else if the government could

2588
01:57:34,200 --> 01:57:32,650
get helicopters there that quickly they

2589
01:57:35,970 --> 01:57:34,210
had to know in advance and from other

2590
01:57:38,279 --> 01:57:35,980
cases just like the ones that you were

2591
01:57:40,560 --> 01:57:38,289
describing in Brazil there's a track

2592
01:57:43,319 --> 01:57:40,570
record indicating that people can be

2593
01:57:44,759 --> 01:57:43,329
affected look at the kovat virus we're

2594
01:57:46,439 --> 01:57:44,769
all over this fact that if you knew in

2595
01:57:48,359 --> 01:57:46,449
advance you could have said something

2596
01:57:51,120 --> 01:57:48,369
that might have kept plenty of people

2597
01:57:53,100 --> 01:57:51,130
out of harm's way so air are you

2598
01:57:57,180 --> 01:57:53,110
culpable when it comes to lawsuit like

2599
01:58:00,660 --> 01:57:57,190
cash Landrum could you approach from the

2600
01:58:03,299 --> 01:58:00,670
perspective of your your jury members or

2601
01:58:04,950 --> 01:58:03,309
the judge who can show you can show a

2602
01:58:07,049 --> 01:58:04,960
track record that the government has

2603
01:58:10,649 --> 01:58:07,059
been aware of things and they left the

2604
01:58:12,000 --> 01:58:10,659
people totally exposed by not informing

2605
01:58:13,290 --> 01:58:12,010
them that hey we don't know what these

2606
01:58:15,419 --> 01:58:13,300
things are maybe you shouldn't approach

2607
01:58:17,279 --> 01:58:15,429
too closely meaning don't get out of

2608
01:58:18,660 --> 01:58:17,289
your car and stand by the front while

2609
01:58:20,520 --> 01:58:18,670
the things sitting there exhuming

2610
01:58:22,830 --> 01:58:20,530
radiation on you but you could have told

2611
01:58:25,020 --> 01:58:22,840
them anything you know don't get close

2612
01:58:26,850 --> 01:58:25,030
back up that might have helped them

2613
01:58:28,169 --> 01:58:26,860
maybe Vicki wouldn't have been exposed

2614
01:58:29,790 --> 01:58:28,179
to already rather wouldn't have been

2615
01:58:32,850 --> 01:58:29,800
exposed as badly or either one of them

2616
01:58:35,430 --> 01:58:32,860
but to not tell them that something is a

2617
01:58:36,899 --> 01:58:35,440
danger I guarantee you if I didn't tell

2618
01:58:39,060 --> 01:58:36,909
you there was an alligator in my

2619
01:58:41,160 --> 01:58:39,070
backyard and I let you go out there and

2620
01:58:43,560 --> 01:58:41,170
get bitten you'd sue the out of me

2621
01:58:46,970 --> 01:58:43,570
because I knew and I didn't bother to

2622
01:58:50,040 --> 01:58:46,980
take due caution on it so I think maybe

2623
01:58:53,370 --> 01:58:50,050
either it was stupidity on the part of

2624
01:58:57,390 --> 01:58:53,380
whoever was forming their case that they

2625
01:58:59,370 --> 01:58:57,400
the judge effectively threw out I don't

2626
01:59:00,720 --> 01:58:59,380
even think that the defense attorneys

2627
01:59:03,959 --> 01:59:00,730
had to say much of anything but hey

2628
01:59:06,629 --> 01:59:03,969
wasn't ours I won't thank you for that

2629
01:59:09,419 --> 01:59:06,639
input I wanted to mention something

2630
01:59:11,669 --> 01:59:09,429
interesting and that is Peter Gersten

2631
01:59:15,359 --> 01:59:11,679
founder of citizens against UFO secrecy

2632
01:59:19,470 --> 01:59:15,369
who was a criminal defense attorney he

2633
01:59:22,200 --> 01:59:19,480
actually had an interesting case doctor

2634
01:59:24,479 --> 01:59:22,210
with dr. Hynek Peter Gersten sued the

2635
01:59:26,160 --> 01:59:24,489
CIA and FBI over the release of 5,000

2636
01:59:28,080 --> 01:59:26,170
UFO related government documents and

2637
01:59:30,950 --> 01:59:28,090
also brought lawsuits against such

2638
01:59:34,490 --> 01:59:30,960
organizations as the NSA dia

2639
01:59:38,690 --> 01:59:34,500
eh-eh and had a famous interview with

2640
01:59:41,780 --> 01:59:38,700
Tom Schneider or a Tom Schneider and dr.

2641
01:59:43,340 --> 01:59:41,790
Hynek about those topics anyway I'm

2642
01:59:47,300 --> 01:59:43,350
really glad that we were able to have

2643
01:59:50,900 --> 01:59:47,310
Jann eldritch and Christian Lambright

2644
01:59:53,570 --> 01:59:50,910
both iconic veteran UFO researchers in

2645
01:59:56,450 --> 01:59:53,580
their own right you have really done us

2646
01:59:58,330 --> 01:59:56,460
a big favor in and out of the UFO

2647
02:00:00,770 --> 01:59:58,340
community regarding their decades

2648
02:00:03,020 --> 02:00:00,780
multiple decades-long work on the UFO

2649
02:00:05,060 --> 02:00:03,030
topics and other and other interesting

2650
02:00:15,770 --> 02:00:05,070
topics so thank you very much for having

2651
02:00:17,900 --> 02:00:15,780
been on our show today yeah I appreciate

2652
02:00:19,850 --> 02:00:17,910
it that Jan and that Christian and of

2653
02:00:22,190 --> 02:00:19,860
course Dave who's left us earlier so

2654
02:00:25,400 --> 02:00:22,200
yeah thanks for tuning in I think we had

2655
02:00:28,459 --> 02:00:25,410
a great show today and hopefully we took

2656
02:00:30,350 --> 02:00:28,469
your mind off some of the real world

2657
02:00:32,690 --> 02:00:30,360
problems that are going on right now and

2658
02:00:34,850 --> 02:00:32,700
we'll be back with more shows to keep